who do you think will dominant his weight the most?

Josh Johnson or Harrison Courtney.

If rangers rankings are somewhat accurate of who will be in these weight classes, then I say this is a tough one to call.  I think they both could pin there way through state.  I will take Courtney being more dominant, but I dont think either one will be challenged. 

Zarth will be pretty dominant this year as well.  I don't see anyone challenging him other than out of state.

[glow=red,2,300]DUSTY STENGEL!![/glow]

[move][shadow=red,left]DUSTY STENGEL!![/shadow][/move]

zarth, courtney, and johnson will all be dominant this year.

I would look out for J.J. Jude this year too. he wont be as impressive as the other 3 i mentioned but by his sophmore/junior year I think he will be as good if not better.

zarth, courtney, and johnson will all be dominant this year.

I would look out for J.J. Jude this year too. he wont be as impressive as the other 3 i mentioned but by his sophmore/junior year I think he will be as good if not better.

Come on. JJ Jude?? Are you serious? [glow=red,2,300]Duncan Caddell [/glow] will dominate him and the 135lb weight class.

Come on. JJ Jude?? Are you serious? [glow=red,2,300]Duncan Caddell [/glow] will dominate him and the 135lb weight class.

WHAT!?! oh oh i get it you were joking okay, right?

Come on. JJ Jude?? Are you serious? [glow=red,2,300]Duncan Caddell [/glow] will dominate him and the 135lb weight class.

i doubt he will dominate the 135 class. i dont think he will even win state.

and if i had to guess id say his and Jude wont even be in the same class. Im predictings Jude to be at least 140.

Only time will tell. Oh, I almost forgot. Jude has never beat Duncan Caddell by more than [glow=red,2,300]1 point[/glow], so if it comes down to it, it should be a good match.  I think [glow=red,2,300]Duncan [/glow] would win though.

Only time will tell. Oh, I almost forgot. Jude has never beat Duncan Caddell by more than [glow=red,2,300]1 point[/glow], so if it comes down to it, it should be a good match.  I think [glow=red,2,300]Duncan [/glow] would win though.

who is this kid? i have never seen him or heard of him what school does he goto has he ever made it to state?

Man you have to be joking with Jude. Jude doesn't match up well against Johnson. Not giving anything away from Jude, he beat me last year, but he got closed to teched if not got teched by Johnson at state. The only way I could see Johnson dominating is if Ervin drops down to 130.

Man you have to be joking with Jude. Jude doesn't match up well against Johnson. Not giving anything away from Jude, he beat me last year, but he got closed to teched if not got teched by Johnson at state. The only way I could see Johnson dominating is if Ervin drops down to 130.

130 Josh Johnson Record: 5- 0 1st Place

Result Opponent School How

Won Mason Fuller Ashland Blazer Fall 1:52

Won Jake Skinner Christian County Dec 7-3

Won Talon Deinlein Campbell County Fall 1:55

Won J.J. Jude Johnson Central T-Fall 19-4

Won Caleb Ervin Union County Dec 7-5

who is this kid? i have never seen him or heard of him what school does he goto has he ever made it to state?

He is from Whitley CO. and has been to high school state 3 times, and middle school state 2 times. He got 2nd place in middle school state, he lost to jj. Jude in the finals by 1 point. Last year he was one match away from placing in the high school state. you need to check yourself before you start downing people you don't know anything about.  Just for fun, I'll talk him into wrestling Jude at a duel match this season, so you can see how bad of a wrestler Jude really is. 

Caddell was 2 rounds from placing. So maybe you should check yourself before exaggerating your/your brother's accomplishments.

He is from Whitley CO. and has been to high school state 3 times, and middle school state 2 times. He got 2nd place in middle school state, he lost to jj. Jude in the finals by 1 point. Last year he was one match away from placing in the high school state. you need to check yourself before you start downing people you don't know anything about.  Just for fun, I'll talk him into wrestling Jude at a duel match this season, so you can see how bad of a wrestler Jude really is.  

so your saying somebody who places in high school state as an 8TH GRADER is a bad wrestler?

He is from Whitley CO. and has been to high school state 3 times, and middle school state 2 times. He got 2nd place in middle school state, he lost to jj. Jude in the finals by 1 point. Last year he was one match away from placing in the high school state. you need to check yourself before you start downing people you don't know anything about.  Just for fun, I'll talk him into wrestling Jude at a duel match this season, so you can see how bad of a wrestler Jude really is. 

wow nice middle school state who cares about that!(not meaning to take away from middle schoolers but this is high school, please nobody give me crap about this comment)

and i havent talked down about him i simply stated that i have never heard or seen him, therefor he cant be great and you are totally going to look dumb if this kid isnt in the finals

wow nice middle school state who cares about that!(not meaning to take away from middle schoolers but this is high school, please nobody give me crap about this comment)

and i havent talked down about him i simply stated that i have never heard or seen him, therefor he cant be great and you are totally going to look dumb if this kid isnt in the finals

[/quote

He already looks dumb. Maybe you should switch up the comment. You are totally gonna look smart if he makes it to the finals :-D

He is from Whitley CO. and has been to high school state 3 times, and middle school state 2 times. He got 2nd place in middle school state, he lost to jj. Jude in the finals by 1 point. Last year he was one match away from placing in the high school state. you need to check yourself before you start downing people you don't know anything about.  Just for fun, I'll talk him into wrestling Jude at a duel match this season, so you can see how bad of a wrestler Jude really is. 

rookie mistake. i would advise you to just stop talking this kid up and let him wrestle. you've done enough damage for him/yourself already. all your going to do is put a big red and white bullseye on his back. and now once he isnt in the finals, or once Jude beats him, your going to look very, very, very, very stupid.

haha nice eagle and yea wc125 you have said enough i already dont like the kid now and i dont even know him and thats just not fair for him

Zarth will be pretty dominant this year as well.  I don't see anyone challenging him other than out of state.

Zarth will meet a stud at 119, the wrestlers ranger has ranked under him have potential.

Zarth will meet a stud at 119, the wrestlers ranger has ranked under him have potential.

no doubt that there are some good guys there but his weight class was much harder the last two years and i just feel he will dominate his weight. just they same sanders last year was raw but courtney was just on another level

no doubt that there are some good guys there but his weight class was much harder the last two years and i just feel he will dominate his weight. just they same sanders last year was raw but courtney was just on another level

point taken, but lets not compare courtney to zarth.

point taken, but lets not compare courtney to zarth.

Why not?  They're both excellent wrestlers and I think both will dominate their in-state opponents this year.

Why not?  They're both excellent wrestlers and I think both will dominate their in-state opponents this year.

Agreed, but its like (using somebody elses analogy) comparing Allen Iverson to Michael Jordan. Both are superstars, both are great, but only one is/was the very best. Zarth will likely win state this year, and become Lexington's first 3 time state champion. But Harrison Courtney is going to be a 4 time state champion, and he is going to do in the best way to do it, not cutting weight so that you can run from better opponents, but wrestling his natural weight and simply dominating everyone in the last 4 years.

Harrison Courtney is already thought of as one of the best wrestlers in the state of Kentucky ever. I mean we're talking about a guy here who should be a 5 time state chamion, but his young nerves got the best of him when he was in the 8th grade. I believe that he may be, the very best to ever wrestle in Kentucky.

zarth, courtney, and johnson will all be dominant this year.

I would look out for J.J. Jude this year too. he wont be as impressive as the other 3 i mentioned but by his sophmore/junior year I think he will be as good if not better.

I dont know about J.J. Jude being as dominant as these three. He could win state twice, maybe even three times, but i dont see him dominating the way these three do.

Especially not if [glow=green,2,300][shadow=green,left]DUNCAN CADELL!!![/shadow][/glow] has anything to say about it!!!!!!!!!!  :-D

I dont know about J.J. Jude being as dominant as these three. He could win state twice, maybe even three times, but i dont see him dominating the way these three do.

Especially not if [glow=green,2,300][shadow=green,left]DUNCAN CADELL!!![/shadow][/glow] has anything to say about it!!!!!!!!!!  :-D

It's official. Duncan Cadell is the David Lieberum of this season. lol

Caddell was 2 rounds from placing. So maybe you should check yourself before exaggerating your/your brother's accomplishments.

Sorry. I realized that after I wrote it. He's my brother.

It's official. Duncan Cadell is the David Lieberum of this season. lol

Amen.

wow nice middle school state who cares about that!(not meaning to take away from middle schoolers but this is high school, please nobody give me crap about this comment)

and i havent talked down about him i simply stated that i have never heard or seen him, therefor he cant be great and you are totally going to look dumb if this kid isnt in the finals

I guess it would make you dumb if he is. Oh, and you don't have to be famous to be dominate.

rookie mistake. i would advise you to just stop talking this kid up and let him wrestle. you've done enough damage for him/yourself already. all your going to do is put a big red and white bullseye on his back. and now once he isnt in the finals, or once Jude beats him, your going to look very, very, very, very stupid.

No mistake here, in fact, I would encourage all of the so called "Best" to go after him.

No mistake here, in fact, I would encourage all of the so called "Best" to go after him.

I bet he gets stomped by some pud, caught on his back and a slap of the mat, its over! haha

Agreed, but its like (using somebody elses analogy) comparing Allen Iverson to Michael Jordan. Both are superstars, both are great, but only one is/was the very best. Zarth will likely win state this year, and become Lexington's first 3 time state champion. But Harrison Courtney is going to be a 4 time state champion, and he is going to do in the best way to do it, not cutting weight so that you can run from better opponents, but wrestling his natural weight and simply dominating everyone in the last 4 years.

Harrison Courtney is already thought of as one of the best wrestlers in the state of Kentucky ever. I mean we're talking about a guy here who should be a 5 time state chamion, but his young nerves got the best of him when he was in the 8th grade. I believe that he may be, the very best to ever wrestle in Kentucky.

first of all, cutting weight doesnt necasarily mean you are running from anyone. besides zarth naturally weighs around 125 or 126, probably lower as the season goes on, so he isnt even cutting all that much. i dont see anyone at 125 or 130 that zarth would run from, this year or the past two. yeah there are good kids there, and have been in the past, but i dont think he wrestled and will wrestle 119 because he is running from any competitor.

and btw 385 you know i could have been a 5 time state champion, but i just wasnt good enough and my young nerves got the best of me...

no need to make excuses for anyone, courtney is a great wrestler, even without five state championships...

first of all, cutting weight doesnt necasarily mean you are running from anyone. besides zarth naturally weighs around 125 or 126, probably lower as the season goes on, so he isnt even cutting all that much. i dont see anyone at 125 or 130 that zarth would run from, this year or the past two. yeah there are good kids there, and have been in the past, but i dont think he wrestled and will wrestle 119 because he is running from any competitor.

and btw 385 you know i could have been a 5 time state champion, but [glow=red,2,300]i just wasnt good enough [/glow]and my young nerves got the best of me...

no need to make excuses for anyone, courtney is a great wrestler, even without five state championships...

Zarth is nowhere near, nor will he ever be, the caliber wrestler Harrison Courtney is. Period. No argument you can make.

Everyone and their mother could have been a 6 time state champion... anything is possible. The point I was making is that Harrison Courtney was right there in the semi-finals and lost to the eventual champion on a stalling call. You probably never got close to even placing, unless you are D.C. Evans, in which case you were just a one hit wonder, and nobody will ever remember anything about you.

Zarth is nowhere near, nor will he ever be, the caliber wrestler Harrison Courtney is. Period. No argument you can make.

Everyone and their mother could have been a 6 time state champion... anything is possible. The point I was making is that Harrison Courtney was right there in the semi-finals and lost to the eventual champion on a stalling call. You probably never got close to even placing, unless you are D.C. Evans, in which case you were just a one hit wonder, and nobody will ever remember anything about you.

That's kind of cold man, I heard DC was wrestling in college.

to be honest i was making fun of you, ive never been close to placing. excuses are like but holes, everyones got one. no need to make them. you dont see harrison getting on here and making one for why he lost his 8th grade year... do you? so why should you do it for him?

That's kind of cold man, I heard DC was wrestling in college.

I don't care if he's wrestling in college. Im so sick of reading what this idiot is typing. Besides, D.C'll just screw up wherever he is at... the kid is a headcase.

to be honest i was making fun of you, ive never been close to placing. excuses are like but holes, everyones got one. no need to make them. you dont see harrison getting on here and making one for why he lost his 8th grade year... do you? so why should you do it for him?

Nobody was making excuses for Harrison, i merely made the statement that he should have been a 5 time state champion, and wasn't. He is the best wrestler in Kentucky ever, no comparison between him and Zarth. Just drop this one. We can continue with Evans if you want...

[.Nobody was making excuses for Harrison, i merely made the statement that he should have been a 5 time state champion, and wasn't. He is the best wrestler in Kentucky ever, no comparison between him and Zarth. Just drop this one. We can continue with Evans if you want...

ive actually heard that joe still runs him at practice from time to time.

[.Nobody was making excuses for Harrison, i merely made the statement that he should have been a 5 time state champion, and wasn't. He is the best wrestler in Kentucky ever, no comparison between him and Zarth. Just drop this one. We can continue with Evans if you want...

I beg to differ. There is a guy named Joe Carr Jr. that Harrison will tell you was better in high school that Harrison is now. Come on, 4x state champ with a 2nd thrown in to boot and he held the national record for wins at one time. Harrison is a great guy and I really enjoy watching him wrestle but he would get detroyed by Joe.

I completely agree with this and i was pretty sure that i mentioned mister carr. i knew somebody was going to mention him lol.

ive actually heard that joe still runs him at practice from time to time.

ive heard this also.

I can tell you as a first-hand witness that Joe can tell Harrison the set-up, move and finish beforehand and still hit it clean as a whistle; and can do it as many times in a row as he wants.  One time Joe took me down with the same exact move like 10 times in a row.  The man is just that good.

I can tell you as a first-hand witness that Joe can tell Harrison the set-up, move and finish beforehand and still hit it clean as a whistle; and can do it as many times in a row as he wants.  One time Joe took me down with the same exact move like 10 times in a row.  The man is just that good.

yeah joe is a beast.. no doubt about it. but that is with how many more years of wrestling than harrison? harrison could be that good when he's finished though.

I can tell you as a first-hand witness that Joe can tell Harrison the set-up, move and finish beforehand and still hit it clean as a whistle; and can do it as many times in a row as he wants.  One time Joe took me down with the same exact move like 10 times in a row.  The man is just that good.

That is incredible.  I heard Joe Carr Jr was that good, but I only got to watch him at state 2 years, his 8th grade year and his Sr year.  Harrison is awesome, and it's hard to imagine anyone beating him that bad.  Joe's 8th grade year I think he was at 103, so you always got to consider the competition.  His sr year he played with everyone so badly I think a lot of guys ran from him too, so you never got to see him actually wrestle.  That's impressive.

how does joe jr compare to the rest of the family?

how does joe jr compare to the rest of the family?

Well, I'm not completely sure on all the brothers and their stats, but his dad and one uncle competed internationally so right off the bat they are ahead of Jr. That being said, even Nate (Olympic bronze medalist) was not the champ in the family. Joe Sr will tell you that.

yeah joe is a beast.. no doubt about it. but that is with how many more years of wrestling than harrison? harrison could be that good when he's finished though.

I credit Harrison with massive amounts of skill and count his father as a friend, but having said that, if you paired the two up them up in their high school prime I would take Joe Jr.

Zarth lost in ot this weekend. Harrison hasn't come close to ot. I was right all along.

Zarth lost in ot this weekend. Harrison hasn't come close to ot. I was right all along.

who did he lose too?

Osborne

yes ill be the first to admit i was wrong looks like i havent given osborn enough credit

Agreed, but its like (using somebody elses analogy) comparing Allen Iverson to Michael Jordan. Both are superstars, both are great, but only one is/was the very best. Zarth will likely win state this year, and become Lexington's first 3 time state champion. But Harrison Courtney is going to be a 4 time state champion, and he is going to do in the best way to do it, not cutting weight so that you can run from better opponents, but wrestling his natural weight and simply dominating everyone in the last 4 years.

Harrison Courtney is already thought of as one of the best wrestlers in the state of Kentucky ever. I mean we're talking about a guy here who should be a 5 time state chamion, but his young nerves got the best of him when he was in the 8th grade. I believe that he may be, the very best to ever wrestle in Kentucky.

i cant believe that you said harrison courtney could be the best wrestler ever in ky...i would be willing to bet that he could not beat any of the top eight wrestlers in the 90's  i love wrestling but the competition in ky now is terrible...you are putting him over his ass coach and issiac knable..i think the murton brothers were better than him  lets get real

i cant believe that you said harrison courtney could be the best wrestler ever in ky...i would be willing to bet that he could not beat any of the top eight wrestlers in the 90's  i love wrestling but the competition in ky now is terrible...you are putting him over his butt coach and issiac knable..i think the murton brothers were better than him  lets get real

competition in kentucky right now is as good as it has ever been maybe better.  i would say the only way to compare the different generations is how well the kids are doing at nationals & after high school.  the 2 guys you mentioned from the 90's can't hold a candle to what Ruschell has accomplished in college.  Throw in Starks, the Murtons, Brad Cooper, Taylor Shearer (sp), Mason Reid, Peace, John Wolsiefer, Ervin, etc....wrestling in Ky right now is doing damn good!  Has Kentucky EVER had 2 kids ranked in the top 20 in D1?  I very seriously doubt it. 

As far as Courtney has gone, he's on pace to be a 4xer, hasn't lost in this state i think someone said since his 8th grade year?  Maybe 9th.  And he's been in the meat grinder every year.  I'll grant you Joe Carr jr probably would have beat him, not so sure about Knable.  Murton brothers I'd agree with you too, but they are not from the 90's...and they are transplants.  I believe they cut their teeth up in Ohio wrestling for some 4X ohio guy named Eric Burnett.  There were some great wrestlers in the 90's for sure, but give these new guys their props too.

competition in kentucky right now is as good as it has ever been maybe better.  i would say the only way to compare the different generations is how well the kids are doing at nationals & after high school.  the 2 guys you mentioned from the 90's can't hold a candle to what Ruschell has accomplished in college.  Throw in Starks, the Murtons, Brad Cooper, Taylor Shearer (sp), Mason Reid, Peace, John Wolsiefer, Ervin, etc....wrestling in Ky right now is doing damn good!  Has Kentucky EVER had 2 kids ranked in the top 20 in D1?  I very seriously doubt it. 

As far as Courtney has gone, he's on pace to be a 4xer, hasn't lost in this state i think someone said since his 8th grade year?  Maybe 9th.  And he's been in the meat grinder every year.  I'll grant you Joe Carr jr probably would have beat him, not so sure about Knable.  Murton brothers I'd agree with you too, but they are not from the 90's...and they are transplants.  I believe they cut their teeth up in Ohio wrestling for some 4X ohio guy named Eric Burnett.  There were some great wrestlers in the 90's for sure, but give these new guys their props too.

I believe his last loss was to Pat Banks at State Duals his freshman year in that epic Larue-Woodford final. I thin Larue won it something like 31-30.

that's what i was thinking.  i bet that was a crazy dual meet.

i cant believe that you said harrison courtney could be the best wrestler ever in ky...i would be willing to bet that he could not beat any of the top eight wrestlers in the 90's  i love wrestling but the competition in ky now is terrible...you are putting him over his butt coach and issiac knable..i think the murton brothers were better than him  lets get real

Don't even get me started on Knable. He was a great wrestler, but Shaun Smith was royally sc****d. Everyone knows who the better wrestler was out of the two, if you had seen the match.

Don't even get me started on Knable. He was a great wrestler, but Shaun Smith was royally sc****d. Everyone knows who the better wrestler was out of the two, if you had seen the match.

who is shaun smith and wat was the occassion you are tlking about?

Courtney is probably one of the top ten wrestlers to ever come out of Kentucky, quite an accomplishment if you ask me.  I don't count the Murtons because they came halfway through their high school careers; they weren't born and raised in KY.  Knable wouldn't make my top 10 list for two reasons.  One he wasn't as good as his stats suggested and two he lived in Indiana but wrestled for St X (a private school).

IMO wrestlers from the 2000's who were in Harrison's league were:

Kyle Ruschell

Richard Starks

Brad Cooper

Luke Metzger

Taylor Scherer

Mitch Ervin

Courtney is probably one of the top ten wrestlers to ever come out of Kentucky, quite an accomplishment if you ask me.  I don't count the Murtons because they came halfway through their high school careers; they weren't born and raised in KY.  Knable wouldn't make my top 10 list for two reasons.  One he wasn't as good as his stats suggested and two he lived in Indiana but wrestled for St X (a private school).

IMO wrestlers from the 2000's who were in Harrison's league were:

Kyle Ruschell

Richard Starks

Brad Cooper

Luke Metzger

Taylor Scherer

Mitch Ervin

Can you elaborate on Knable? I never saw him wrestle and always heard he was one of the best. Who is Shaun Smith and what happened in their match?

Can you elaborate on Knable? I never saw him wrestle and always heard he was one of the best. Who is Shaun Smith and what happened in their match?

really all i know about him is that he dominated in high school, but then went on to do nothing in college.

All Knable ever did was all that was asked of him. He had nagging injuries that prevented him from having a stellar career at Indiana. But, give him credit for wrestling Div 1 in the toughest conference in America. I know he was respected by his coaches (no slouches there) and team.

He can be seen at most all St X's matches coaching the JVs. That's what you call giving back. Here, in Kentucky not in Indiana. I don't know why there would be such a lack of respect except for envy.

i never said that this generation was terrible...there are good wrestlers but the statement that harrison was maybe they best to come out of ky was not even close....everyone says they dont count they mourton bros because they come from out of state  and that just proves that ky wrestling is so far behind other states..i love ky wrestling  but the competition is not good.....basically i just wanted to get out that courtney is not the best to come out of ky...(i still think he is good though , no one get upset)

i never said that this generation was terrible...there are good wrestlers but the statement that harrison was maybe they best to come out of ky was not even close....everyone says they dont count they mourton bros because they come from out of state   and that just proves that ky wrestling is so far behind other states..i love ky wrestling  but the competition is not good.....basically i just wanted to get out that courtney is not the best to come out of ky...(i still think he is good though , no one get upset)

I'm going to borrow an idea from dinubus and say that if you are going to make a comment like that about Courtney, then you probably should have some sort of logic or criteria to base it on.  And I find it hard to believe that there is any criteria where Courtney would not even be close to another KY wrestler, ever.  If/when he becomes a 4-time state champ I think it is a no brainer that he is one of the best ever.  And you could make a pretty good argument that with the 3 he has already won (with a nice run as an 8th grader) at tough weight classes, he is already there no matter what happens this season.

Knable was aggressive, strong and in shape but his technique lacked.  He was decent on top but on his feet the only takedown I ever remember seeing him get was a straight double that he shot from way out.  If he had wrestled in Ohio I don't know if he would have ever even placed at the state tournament.  Even if he hadn't been injured I don't think he would have done much at Indiana.  One of the Woodford wrestlers was at Indiana at the same time and reportedly beat on Knable and said he got pushed around the room.

to brag about harrison then diss knable is retarded seeing that knable a was a 4 timer too..  look at who harrison wrestles  there is no competition ..  he is good but no better than a lot of others..you can say that he is maybe in the top 50 to come out of ky but not the best  i can name a few who i think were better(my opinion) wolisifer  knable    murton bros  joe carr  there are several other wrestlers that came just from woodford that were just as good as courtney...i cant think of a lot of names but they are there....these are just my opinions and some people say i am wrong but it dont matter....i think what i think and others think what they think

Knable was aggressive, strong and in shape but his technique lacked.  He was decent on top but on his feet the only takedown I ever remember seeing him get was a straight double that he shot from way out.  If he had wrestled in Ohio I don't know if he would have ever even placed at the state tournament.  Even if he hadn't been injured I don't think he would have done much at Indiana.  One of the Woodford wrestlers was at Indiana at the same time and reportedly beat on Knable and said he got pushed around the room.

That must of been one great double to get him 4 state championships.

That must of been one great double to get him 4 state championships.

lol wow i really laughed out loud at that comment...

maddog, you said that Courtney was probably in the top 50 but you only named 4-5 people that you thought were better, whats up with that?

That must of been one great double to get him 4 state championships.

Lol that is a funny comment.  It was a pretty good double but he wouldn't have even got to Joe Joe or Ian Horn's leg.  When I think about if a wrestler is great or not I think about if they could compete with the best out of state and I don't think Knable could.  I guess he proved that when he went to Indiana and got stomped in the room.  I am saying this as a wrestler who got beat soundly by Knable twice our junior years but has had a taste of the best from Ohio and PA.

The only Woodford wrestler who I would put above Courtney for sure is Joe Jr.  Maybe Starks, Horn, Chris Dunn, or Jeff Fitch (but I never saw him wrestle).

To say that Courtney is not in the top ten ever from KY is laughable.  You do realize you're witnessing (if he pulls through again this year) the ONLY 6x state placer ever right?  He has proven that he can compete out of state and I know from wrestling with him that he can step into a college program and immediately make an impact.  Actually he should have won it his eighth grade year as well but was screwed in the semis against the Wayne Co kid who he beat like 10-1 at state duals.

look at who harrison wrestles   there is no competition ..

Lets Take a look...

Eighth Grade Year (130 Pounds): 3rd Place (4-1); Lost in the semi-finals to the eventual champion whom he (as stated above) beat like 10-1 at state duals. Notable Matches: Quarter Finals he beat Bryan Peace 9-1, Then in the 3rd place match he PINNED Bryan Peace in 1:49.

Ninth Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); Pinned or Tech Falled up to semi-finals when he beat Rob Aylor (Ryle/Eventual Third Placer) 4-0, In the finals he beat Pat Banks (Larue/Last person ever to beat Courtney in Kentucky at State Duals again, as mentioned previously) 4-2. Note: Pat Banks beat Mitch Ervin 11-4 in Semi-Finals.

Tenth Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); Pinned in the first and second rounds, as well as Semi-Finals. He Pinned Daniel Thueneman (Scott County) in Overtime. Majored Tim Winchester in the quarterfinals, and Beau Sanders in the Finals. NOTE: In the finals at 152 Mitch Ervin beat Pat Banks and went on to win MOW.

Eleventh Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); MOW. PINNED OR TECHED THROUGHOUT THE STATE TOURNAMENT. DID NOT GIVE UP A SINGLE POINT THE ENTIRE STATE TOURNAMENT. Pinned Beau Sanders in the finals.

Twelfth Grade Year: ???

Its really hard to say that Harrison hasn't faced any good competition what with Bryan Peace, Pat Banks, Beau Sanders, and you could throw in Mitch Ervin. These statistics obviously prove that Courtney is top three all time. I predict him pinning through state again this year, then how would that change peoples opinions i wonder?

Also note that he was competing at 130 and 145 his eighth and ninth grade years, that is very impressive in itself.

lol this whole thread has somehow strayed away from Josh Johnson and turned all about Harrison Courtney somehow.

Lets Take a look...

Eighth Grade Year (130 Pounds): 3rd Place (4-1); Lost in the semi-finals to the eventual champion whom he (as stated above) beat like 10-1 at state duals. Notable Matches: Quarter Finals he beat Bryan Peace 9-1, Then in the 3rd place match he PINNED Bryan Peace in 1:49.

Ninth Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); Pinned or Tech Falled up to semi-finals when he beat Rob Aylor (Ryle/Eventual Third Placer) 4-0, In the finals he beat Pat Banks (Larue/Last person ever to beat Courtney in Kentucky at State Duals again, as mentioned previously) 4-2. Note: Pat Banks beat Mitch Ervin 11-4 in Semi-Finals.

Tenth Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); Pinned in the first and second rounds, as well as Semi-Finals. He Pinned Daniel Thueneman (Scott County) in Overtime. Majored Tim Winchester in the quarterfinals, and Beau Sanders in the Finals. NOTE: In the finals at 152 Mitch Ervin beat Pat Banks and went on to win MOW.

Eleventh Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); MOW. PINNED OR TECHED THROUGHOUT THE STATE TOURNAMENT. DID NOT GIVE UP A SINGLE POINT THE ENTIRE STATE TOURNAMENT. Pinned Beau Sanders in the finals.

Twelfth Grade Year: ???

I would add that Aylor was the returning state champ from 140 the previous year.

Lets Take a look...

Eighth Grade Year (130 Pounds): 3rd Place (4-1); Lost in the semi-finals to the eventual champion whom he (as stated above) beat like 10-1 at state duals. Notable Matches: Quarter Finals he beat Bryan Peace 9-1, Then in the 3rd place match he PINNED Bryan Peace in 1:49.

Ninth Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); Pinned or Tech Falled up to semi-finals when he beat Rob Aylor (Ryle/Eventual Third Placer) 4-0, In the finals he beat Pat Banks (Larue/Last person ever to beat Courtney in Kentucky at State Duals again, as mentioned previously) 4-2. Note: Pat Banks beat Mitch Ervin 11-4 in Semi-Finals.

Tenth Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); Pinned in the first and second rounds, as well as Semi-Finals. He Pinned Daniel Thueneman (Scott County) in Overtime. Majored Tim Winchester in the quarterfinals, and Beau Sanders in the Finals. NOTE: In the finals at 152 Mitch Ervin beat Pat Banks and went on to win MOW.

Eleventh Grade Year (145 Pounds): 1st Place (5-0); MOW. PINNED OR TECHED THROUGHOUT THE STATE TOURNAMENT. DID NOT GIVE UP A SINGLE POINT THE ENTIRE STATE TOURNAMENT. Pinned Beau Sanders in the finals.

Twelfth Grade Year: ???

lets not forget about his 7th grade year, didnt he place that year as well?

lets not forget about his 7th grade year, didnt he place that year as well?

Yes as I mentioned in my last post will, barring a horrible injury or tournament, be a 6x state placer.  He placed 8th at 119 losing to Kellen Russell I believe from Ryle in the 7th place match.  Even Joe Joe won his first title at the middle school and underclassmen loaded 103; he wasn't even a starter as a 7th grader.

lets not forget about his 7th grade year, didnt he place that year as well?

I thought about this after i had posted the stats, but i didnt want to comment the same thread three consecutive times lol.

Yes as I mentioned in my last post will, barring a horrible injury or tournament, be a 6x state placer.  He placed 8th at 119 losing to Kellen Russell I believe from Ryle in the 7th place match.  Even Joe Joe won his first title at the middle school and underclassmen loaded 103; he wasn't even a starter as a 7th grader.

Jpizar,

I didn't know Kellen Russell wrestled in KY before going to Blair? why hasn't he been mentioned as one of KY's best?  :-D

Just messin with ya, I'm sure you meant Kellen Ashworth and just made a mental error.

It was Kellen Ashworth. His seventh grade year, his 3 losses at state were to Daniel Thueneman (as history would hold he went on to dominate Thueneman every time the two met from then on), Zach Peters, and Kellen Ashworth.

Seventh Grade Record: 40-6

Also lets not forget he is a 6 time regional champion. There is so much more to back up this kid its ridiculous; Beau Sanders was in his regional weight class i think 3 years? one of these years Beau placed 4th in the region and Harrison won... The year Harrison majored Beau in the finals, that was a regional rematch. How easy would it have been for him to overlook Beau and say im going to beat him just because i did in regionals, like Travis Sullivan with D.C. Evans.

Harrison had 3 losses in the whole season and went on to lose 3 at state, obviously a mental lapse. Nerves of a young wrestler.

It was Kellen Ashworth. His seventh grade year, his 3 losses at state were to Daniel Thueneman (as history would hold he went on to dominate Thueneman every time the two met from then on), Zach Peters, and Kellen Ashworth.

Seventh Grade Record: 40-6

Also lets not forget he is a 6 time regional champion. There is so much more to back up this kid its ridiculous; Beau Sanders was in his regional weight class i think 3 years? one of these years Beau placed 4th in the region and Harrison won... The year Harrison majored Beau in the finals, that was a regional rematch. How easy would it have been for him to overlook Beau and say im going to beat him just because i did in regionals, like Travis Sullivan with D.C. Evans.

Not taking anything away from Courtney, but how is an overtime match dominating someone everytime?

I know they had the overtime match in semifinals, but didn't he beat Thueneman pretty bad on other occasions? forgive me if im wrong. but he did pin Thueneman in that overtime match.

When I think about if a wrestler is great or not I think about if they could compete with the best out of state and I don't think Knable could.  I guess he proved that when he went to Indiana and got stomped in the room. 

Not sure if this is even credible.  Knable form what I recall was All Big 10 one year and wrestled at the NCAA tournament.  Not too many wrestlers from KY can make that claim. 

When comparing the top wrestlers I think you have to look at success at a national level.  State titles are great and should not be diminished but the top wrestlers are able to go beyond the state level and compete with the best from other states.

Ruschell from what I recall placed at Fargo and is obviously having success at the NCAA D1 level.  What about Knable and Courtney?  How do their national level accomplishments in HS compare?  What other KY wrestlers have had success at Fargo, Beast, Ironman, Senior Nationals, etc.??

I know they had the overtime match in semifinals, but didn't he beat Thueneman pretty bad on other occasions? forgive me if im wrong. but he did pin Thueneman in that overtime match.

i dont care what anyone else thinks or says, thueneman would not have gotten pinned if it wasnt overtime. i mean come on, it was overtime, courtney already won whether thueneman got off his back or not, why fight? some could say for pride, but his pride was already broken cause he had already lost the match. i dont give courtney anymore credit for pinning thueneman than he already gets for winning in the first place.

Ruschell from what I recall placed at Fargo and is obviously having success at the NCAA D1 level.  What about Knable and Courtney?  How do their national level accomplishments in HS compare?  What other KY wrestlers have had success at Fargo, Beast, Ironman, Senior Nationals, etc.??

Very few wrestlers even go to these tournaments. It is so discouraging to know that every year we have 3-4 kids going to these tournaments from Kentucky. there is no way possible for us as a state to get better or for anyone else to know that we got better unless we compete at these top notch tournaments.

i dont care what anyone else thinks or says, thueneman would not have gotten pinned if it wasnt overtime. i mean come on, it was overtime, courtney already won whether thueneman got off his back or not, why fight? some could say for pride, but his pride was already broken cause he had already lost the match. i dont give courtney anymore credit for pinning thueneman than he already gets for winning in the first place.

I can somewhat agree with this statement. Technically though, the match was not over yet, Thueneman could have rolled Courtney somehow and pinned him. Thats the only way he could have won. But as for the pride part, I think, 9/10 wrestlers would have tried to fight off of their back. Just saying...

Anyone remember what move Courtney used to put Thueneman on his back in ot? TC125?

i dont remember what move, but actually it was overtime, first takedown wins, im pretty sure that even if thueneman had reversed him to his back, courtney would have won. i think that the rule is as soon as the first takedown is scored, the match is over, unless one is on their back in which case, the match goes on until they are either off their back, or they get pinned. can anyone clarify the rule?

i know what you mean about fighting off your back, but honestly if i had taken harrison courtney to OVERTIME, and then my shot at beating him was shattered, i dont think i could have fought off my back either.

i know what you mean about fighting off your back, but honestly if i had taken harrison courtney to OVERTIME, and then my shot at beating him was shattered, i dont think i could have fought off my back either.

agreed. i too was wondering about the rule. i think they may have allowed him to roll over and get the pin but im not sure. thats a rare situation.

CAN ANYONE CLARIFY THIS?

The 1st overtime is sudden victory. The 1st to score wins. If a wrestler is taken down directly to his back, he is allowed to try to complete the fall. This is for team points.

The 1st overtime is sudden victory. The 1st to score wins. If a wrestler is taken down directly to his back, he is allowed to try to complete the fall. This is for team points.

yeah thats what i figured it was...

that seems unfair... i think if you can turn the kid off your back and stick him you should be allowed to. but then again i can look at the other side of the debate and agree with it.

that seems unfair... i think if you can turn the kid off your back and stick him you should be allowed to. but then again i can look at the other side of the debate and agree with it.

If you can do that, you should do it before it gets to overtime.

Yeah once he had the take down it didn't matter if he rolled him or not.  I was in a similar situation my senior year.  Overtime match, I was taken down to my back, takedown was given(no near fall), then I reversed it.  It didn't matter because the other wrestler scored first.  If I remember right, Theunamen took a deep shot, and Courtney hit some type of Lateral drop or something on him to win the match.  That was a great match by the way.

If you can do that, you should do it before it gets to overtime.

I disagree. You should never be on your back in the first place  :wink:

It was a classic... at least one of my favorites.

Yeah once he had the take down it didn't matter if he rolled him or not.  I was in a similar situation my senior year.  Overtime match, I was taken down to my back, takedown was given(no near fall), then I reversed it.  It didn't matter because the other wrestler scored first.  If I remember right, Theunamen took a deep shot, and Courtney hit some type of Lateral drop or something on him to win the match.  That was a great match by the way.

yeah i think that was it, thueneman shot and almost finished it, then next thing anyone knew he was getting pinned...

yeah i think that was it, thueneman shot and almost finished it, then next thing anyone knew he was getting pinned...

im sure it must suck really bad to know that he was a few inches and a little effort away from altering history. in kentucky at least...

i think whats worse than that is travis sullivans loss last year to corey spencer... history was about to be made, and in 20 seconds, it was all erased... does anyone know of any other wrestler to be undefeated their entire highschool career?

im sure it must suck really bad to know that he was a few inches and a little effort away from altering history. in kentucky at least...

thueneman had a shot 2xs he could have changed history

thueneman had a shot 2xs he could have changed history

lol. i hope hes not reading any of this. that would suck for him.

yeah it prolly would bring back a lot of bad memories. anyway, does anyone know the answer to my question? has anyone else in kentucky wrestling history ever gotten as close to being undefeated there entire highschool career as travis did? besides harrison of course.

yeah it prolly would bring back a lot of bad memories. anyway, does anyone know the answer to my question? has anyone else in kentucky wrestling history ever gotten as close to being undefeated there entire highschool career as travis did? besides harrison of course.

I highly doubt it. And even Harrison isn't undefeated throughout high school. Remember Pat Banks freshman year? Larue Woodford state duals finals...

In sudden victory overtime the first wrestler who scores wins.  If someone is taken to their back then the wrestler who scored is allowed to work for the fall for team points.  If they are immediately flipped then the match is over, no points are given for a reversal; the first wrestler who scores wins the match, no exceptions.  This is why it is called sudden victory.

In the match you are talking about Harrison was up by like 5 points in the third period and Theuneman ended up coming back with like four straight takedowns.  I honestly thought Courtney would lose the match.  In overtime Theuneman shot a good double.  Courtney used his momentum against him and lateral dropped Theuneman to his back for the winning score.  He then worked for the fall and got it.  The two were evenly matched throughout their careers but I believe Courtney had the winning record by like 3 matches.  If my memory serves me correct Theuneman only won two of those meetings, one at the South Oldham tourney one year where Theuneman missed weight and wrestled up to Courtney's weight class and one at the state tourney Harrison's 7th grade year at 119.

Jpizar,

I didn't know Kellen Russell wrestled in KY before going to Blair? why hasn't he been mentioned as one of KY's best?  :-D

Just messin with ya, I'm sure you meant Kellen Ashworth and just made a mental error.

Lol you're right.  It was Kellen Ashworth, didn't he have a brother Kyle that was supposed to be awesome too?

I highly doubt it. And even Harrison isn't undefeated throughout high school. Remember Pat Banks freshman year? Larue Woodford state duals finals...

i knew he wasnt undefeated, but i would also like to know other people with amazing records like harrisons, and travis. wasnt joe carrs record rediculous?

In overtime Theuneman shot a good double.  Courtney used his momentum against him and lateral dropped Theuneman to his back for the winning score.  He then worked for the fall and got it.

If you blinked your eyes you missed this lateral.  I'm still not sure how in the heck Harrison landed on top.  I was on the other side of the gym, but from my view it appeared Daniel actually had both Harrison's legs up in the air and somehow Courtney rolled through and landed on top.  Courtney was pretty much in control the 1st & 2nd periods, but the momentum was definitely on Theuneman's side in OT.

If you blinked your eyes you missed this lateral.  I'm still not sure how in the heck Harrison landed on top.  I was on the other side of the gym, but from my view it appeared Daniel actually had both Harrison's legs up in the air and somehow Courtney rolled through and landed on top.  Courtney was pretty much in control the 1st & 2nd periods, but the momentum was definitely on Theuneman's side in OT.

Yeah I thought Theuneman was going to finish the takedown and win the match too.  Theuneman was a good wrestler and I tried to recruit him but he didn't want to continue his career.

yeah, tc. Joe Jr. had a pretty long streak from soph-senior yr. Maybe 180 matches (just guessing).

Doesnt Joe have the record for ky wins?

Doesnt Joe have the record for ky wins?

I think so unless Sullivan passed him.  Joe had the national record for a long time as well.  At the time Ian Horn, another 5x placer and 3x champ from Woodford was 2nd on the list.  That was pretty cool having two wrestlers from the same school at 1 and 2, especially from KY.

i think sullivan passed him his junior year. wasnt there a story about it in the paper?

i think sullivan passed him his junior year. wasnt there a story about it in the paper?

oh yeah. I think that sullivan actually surpassed the national record. beating out Cael Sanderson. then he lost his last three matches of his high school career (state finals then 0-2 senior nationals)

Cael Sanderson never had the national high school record.  Sanderson graduated from high school the same year as Joe Joe, 1997.  Sanderson has the college national record for most wins at 159.  In case you didn't know Sanderson also never lost a match which, needless to say, is VERY impressive.  Joe Joe was passed by Roger Kish of Lapeer West High School in Michigan (wrestled for Minnesota, 2x All-American, finalist, was hurt bad his last year as a senior and was still a match away from All-American status.  I think a couple others passed Joe as well if I'm not mistaken.

Cael Sanderson never had the national high school record.  Sanderson graduated from high school the same year as Joe Joe, 1997.  Sanderson has the college national record for most wins at 159.  In case you didn't know Sanderson also never lost a match which, needless to say, is VERY impressive.  Joe Joe was passed by Roger Kish of Lapeer West High School in Michigan (wrestled for Minnesota, 2x All-American, finalist, was hurt bad his last year as a senior and was still a match away from All-American status.  I think a couple others passed Joe as well if I'm not mistaken.

well forgive me... lol. i guess he just had more high school career wins than Cael because what i heard about was him surpassing Cael's number of high school career wins.

I know I'll be third on the list with 272 career wins, and top ten in pins with 145 as soon as I turn in all my paper work. I missed a lot of matches too from my soph to junior year.

I know I'll be third on the list with 272 career wins, and top ten in pins with 145 as soon as I turn in all my paper work. I missed a lot of matches too from my soph to junior year.

and you are?? lol how the heck are we supposed to know who you are?

and you are?? lol how the heck are we supposed to know who you are?

lol thats what i was thinking. anyway, what about sullivan? he had what record?

lol thats what i was thinking. anyway, what about sullivan? he had what record?

im pretty sure that he has the record for most career wins in kentucky. not sure though. grappler of old? can you help with this?

Josh Ashbrook from Harrison Co.

Josh Ashbrook from Harrison Co.

why the hell is your name allamerican125? this account must be like 18 years old. lol

why the hell is your name allamerican125? this account must be like 18 years old. lol

lol  :-D plus i just want to put it out there that tc125 and i have been dominating these threads lately. kentuckywrestling would be nothing witout the two of us, danger, and ranger123.

You do realize you're witnessing (if he pulls through again this year) the ONLY 6x state placer ever right?

ah ah ahhh jpizar... not so fast.

Livngston Merrit:

1992- 7th Grade- 5th at 140

1993- 8th Grade- 4th at 152

1994- 9th Grade- 3rd at 189

1995-10th Grade- 1st at 215

1996-11th Grade- 1st at 215

1997-12th Grade- 1st at 275

those are some impressive statistics.

ah ah ahhh jpizar... not so fast.

Livngston Merrit:

1992- 7th Grade- 5th at 140

1993- 8th Grade- 4th at 152

1994- 9th Grade- 3rd at 189

1995-10th Grade- 1st at 215

1996-11th Grade- 1st at 215

1997-12th Grade- 1st at 275

those are some impressive statistics.

not as impressive as harrisons. four state titles?

not as impressive as harrisons. four state titles?

thats why we're talking about Harrison being the best ever in Ky or not. But i think that i would prefer to place 5th and 4th than 8th and 3rd. That just seems better to me.

Can anyone recall who Livingston Merritt lost to in 94 at 189? I assume it was in the semi-finals??

thats why we're talking about Harrison being the best ever in Ky or not. But i think that i would prefer to place 5th and 4th than 8th and 3rd. That just seems better to me.

Can anyone recall who Livingston Merritt lost to in 94 at 189? I assume it was in the semi-finals??

a third place finish to me, is better than a 5th place finish and an 8th place finish. that even disregards his 8th place finish. i would rather win state once, than be a four time 3rd place finisher. maybe its just me, but the glory of the finals would outweigh any other finish, no matter how many times, by far.

a third place finish to me, is better than a 5th place finish and an 8th place finish. that even disregards his 8th place finish. i would rather win state once, than be a four time 3rd place finisher. maybe its just me, but the glory of the finals would outweigh any other finish, no matter how many times, by far.

i was talking about their 7th and 8th grade years. Livingston placed 5th and 4th, while Harrison placed 8th and 3rd.

yeah i know you were, but placing is placing. third is third, and fifth is fifth. its a case by case situation on which is better. maybe you got fifth cause you lost to the state champ first round, then the third placer next, but have beaten the fourth placer and runner up. or maybe its flipped you only got third cause everyone else was on the other side of the bracket. the only place to me that means anything is first. thats without question why you got first. no one can say you only got first everyone else was on the other side of the bracket, cause you still had to beat who ever it was that beat them.

not trying to take anything away from lower finishes, like i said its case by case. so unless i actually look at who harrison beat, and who the other guy beat to get their finishes. i cant say which is better...

yeah i know you were, but placing is placing. third is third, and fifth is fifth. its a case by case situation on which is better. maybe you got fifth cause you lost to the state champ first round, then the third placer next, but have beaten the fourth placer and runner up. or maybe its flipped you only got third cause everyone else was on the other side of the bracket. the only place to me that means anything is first. thats without question why you got first. no one can say you only got first everyone else was on the other side of the bracket, cause you still had to beat who ever it was that beat them.

not trying to take anything away from lower finishes, like i said its case by case. so unless i actually look at who harrison beat, and who the other guy beat to get their finishes. i cant say which is better...

okay thats understandable. but i bet harrison couldn't do a backflip after winning the finals, while weighing 275 pounds!

lol alright alright, someone get that heavyweight the mow award, he deserves it.

lol alright alright, someone get that heavyweight the mow award, he deserves it.

im pretty sure he got the MOW award didn't he?

He didn't actually weigh 275, but more around 230 his senior year. But he never received a mow because he graduated in 1997. The MOW that year was Joe Jr. His 8th grade year I believe he lost to eventual state champ and MOW Blevins from Fern Creek. His freshman year he was on the other side of the bracket of eventual champ Jody Burke from Christian I think. So yes he had some pretty good competition in his day.

He didn't actually weigh 275, but more around 230 his senior year. But he never received a mow because he graduated in 1997. The MOW that year was Joe Jr. His 8th grade year I believe he lost to eventual state champ and MOW Blevins from Fern Creek. His freshman year he was on the other side of the bracket of eventual champ Jody Burke from Christian I think. So yes he had some pretty good competition in his day.

didn't Joe Jr. graduate in '98?

no in 1997

no in 1997

whoops... sorry. :|

well since everyone taliking about Livingstone Merritt I went and got my "old" state tourny bracketts.

1992-7th Grade-140--5th place-Western Ky Regional Champ-lost in semi to 2nd place Archie Stepp(sc), lost to Adam Feldman(st.x),beat Rusty Calvent(h.clay) for 5th

1993-8th-4 place-152-Wky Regional Champ-lost in semi to 2nd place Jamie Brewer(S.Kenton),lost to George Birk(H.Clay) for 4th

1994-9th-3rd place-189-2place wky regional-lost 1 round upset to David Ketcham(Scott)-won 5 straight to place 3rd.

His freshman year he was on the other side of the bracket of eventul champ Jody Burke from Christian

Burke was from Danville ( runner-up in 94 final against Matt Hecker(Woodford) WOW good match) Burke beat McKinley Stepp in finals in 94

1995-10th-1st place-215-

1996-11th -1st place-215-

1997-12th-1st place-hwt-

He was in my weight class my senior year never got to wrestle him thou...

well since everyone taliking about Livingstone Merritt I went and got my "old" state tourny bracketts.

1992-7th Grade-140--5th place-Western Ky Regional Champ-lost in semi to 2nd place Archie Stepp(sc), lost to Adam Feldman(st.x),beat Rusty Calvent(h.clay) for 5th

1993-8th-4 place-152-Wky Regional Champ-lost in semi to 2nd place Jamie Brewer(S.Kenton),lost to George Birk(H.Clay) for 4th

1994-9th-3rd place-189-2place wky regional-lost 1 round upset to David Ketcham(Scott)-won 5 straight to place 3rd. Burke was from Danville ( runner-up in 94 final against Matt Hecker(Woodford) WOW good match) Burke beat McKinley Stepp in finals in 94

1995-10th-1st place-215-

1996-11th -1st place-215-

1997-12th-1st place-hwt-

He was in my weight class my senior year never got to wrestle him thou...

that sucks he lost first round his freshman year.

what is that thing in your picture?

That is his gas tank on his harley. I thought that Burke was from Danville. I remembered him after you said that. Also didn't George Birk from Henry Clay end up winning a title the next year.

That is his gas tank on his harley. I thought that Burke was from Danville. I remembered him after you said that. Also didn't George Birk from Henry Clay end up winning a title the next year.

ohhh... ok i see it now.

Here's how I would match them up:

            Merritt                  Courtney

Grade 7      5th

Grade 8      4th        Grade 7    8th

Grade 9      3rd       Grade 8     3rd

Grade 10     1st       Grade 9     1st

Grade 11     1st       Grade 10   1st

Grade 12     1st       Grade 11   1st

                           Grade 12    ?

So they are "equal" with the 3rd and 3 1st place finishes.  So how do the other 2 years compare.  Merritt with a 5th and 4th or Courtney with an 8th and ? (likely 1st).  Personally, I take the championship over all else.

But we could also take into consideration that if the tourney had not been extended into 32 invites and 8 placers that harrison would not have that 8th place finish. He would of been one short.

we could match it all up a thousand different ways, and compare this statistic to this statistic. it all boils down to who we believe is the best, and everyone knows its Courtney. Hands down.

But we could also take into consideration that if the tourney had not been extended into 32 invites and 8 placers that harrison would not have that 8th place finish. He would of been one short.

Good point.  But I still take that 4th championship over 2 other placements.  No question.

Good point.  But I still take that 4th championship over 2 other placements.  No question.

absolutely. im sure harrison would too. as im sure he will.

I understand how good Courtney is but everyone is also running from him.Of the early years who was in the brackets with him that were dominant or stood out later as he grew. Was there anyone who went on to win titles or challenge others? Your right we could compare all the stats. We wouldn't be having this discussion if Joe Jr. was allowed to wrestle his 7th grade year. we could also match his 4 titles and a second up with Courtney's 4 titles and 3rd and 8th.

But doesnt Courtney already also have 5 Regional Championships going for his 6th this year?

That is his gas tank on his harley.

back fender, Bigdog-K-9 not a Harley.

I understand how good Courtney is but everyone is also running from him.Of the early years who was in the brackets with him that were dominant or stood out later as he grew. Was there anyone who went on to win titles or challenge others? Your right we could compare all the stats. We wouldn't be having this discussion if Joe Jr. was allowed to wrestle his 7th grade year. we could also match his 4 titles and a second up with Courtney's 4 titles and 3rd and 8th.

i dont know if i would point out that joe jr. has a second in his stat book, because to me that is a bad thing. to be able to reach the finals, and not win after having already won, shows a lack of concentration, or something. not taking anything away from joe jr, but i just wouldn't point out this particular stat.

i dont know if i would point out that joe jr. has a second in his stat book, because to me that is a bad thing. to be able to reach the finals, and not win after having already won, shows a lack of concentration, or something. not taking anything away from joe jr, but i just wouldn't point out this particular stat.

why not 119Rider is the one who BEAT HIM

to be able to reach the finals, and not win after having already won, shows a lack of concentration, or something. not taking anything away from joe jr, but i just wouldn't point out this particular stat.

moving from 103 to 119 he ran into some better compition plus not wrestling little boys .....

I was pointing out his second because we were comparing place finishes. His second was higher than courtney's third as a 8th. 4 state titles is 4 state titles. He was not allowed to wrestle as a 7th grader. Do you think he would be of been able to win or place in the top six as a seventh grader? I'm pretty sure he could of, therefore he would be considered the best. Merritt was able to and made the most of his opportunity just as courtney did. If he goes on to compete in college and is successful then I would give him the nod over Merritt but probably not Joe Jr who has a well documented career as we all know. Not taking anything away from Courtney just waiting before I cast my ballot. Would like to see an all time top ten list by you guys to see what everyone else thinks.

Joe Joe was allowed to compete as a 7th grader.  He was varsity at the beginning of the year but then was beat out by a kid named Cody Stewart.

I was pointing out his second because we were comparing place finishes. His second was higher than courtney's third as a 8th. 4 state titles is 4 state titles. He was not allowed to wrestle as a 7th grader. Do you think he would be of been able to win or place in the top six as a seventh grader? I'm pretty sure he could of, therefore he would be considered the best. Merritt was able to and made the most of his opportunity just as courtney did. If he goes on to compete in college and is successful then I would give him the nod over Merritt but probably not Joe Jr who has a well documented career as we all know. Not taking anything away from Courtney just waiting before I cast my ballot. Would like to see an all time top ten list by you guys to see what everyone else thinks.

wow... it must be so cool to be able to tell kids, i was the only one that ever beat Joe Carr Jr. in the state finals. did the two of you ever meet again after that? or was it your senior year?

Thanks for that info Pizar. I was always under the impression that Joe was held out that year.

385-We never met again. I was a senior when he was a freshman, I went on to coach against him a couple of times and then off to college to wrestle. Needless to say he out grew me.

Thanks for that info Pizar. I was always under the impression that Joe was held out that year.

385-We never met again. I was a senior when he was a freshman, I went on to coach against him a couple of times and then off to college to wrestle. Needless to say he out grew me.

hey, you still got one on him! thats so cool...

how does everybody feel that Harrison Courtney would have done at Beast of the East? keep this thread going.

I dont know exactly how he would do, but I would say he would make the finals at 52 or 60. Don't know these kids like I used to but I do believe Peppelman was highly ranked nationally at 52. Courtney usually rises to his competition like a great wrestler should and he would fair well. As far as the super 32 showing and his 2-2 finish. Most of the guys that wrestle in that tourney are wrestling year round for schollies. You got to be in top shape yeaar round to stay on that level.

I dont know exactly how he would do, but I would say he would make the finals at 52 or 60. Don't know these kids like I used to but I do believe Peppelman was highly ranked nationally at 52. Courtney usually rises to his competition like a great wrestler should and he would fair well. As far as the super 32 showing and his 2-2 finish. Most of the guys that wrestle in that tourney are wrestling year round for schollies. You got to be in top shape yeaar round to stay on that level.

yeah super32 is a fairly early tournament and its one of the hardest out there. anyone know the two people that courtney lost too?

i really think that Harrison can compete at these national tournaments, partially because ive seen him do such, at sophomore nationals. god... it ticks me off so bad that he should be a national champion.

I dont know exactly how he would do, but I would say he would make the finals at 52 or 60.

Based on the results from Super 32 and the Beast I would say that Harrison even placing at these tournaments would not be a sure thing let alone the finals.  Looks like the brackets for both had several similar guys.  Peppelman won both and he beat Harrison 9-1 at Super 32.  Harrsion's 2nd loss was to a guy that didn't even place.  The number 7 placer was the same at both tournaments so this is another indication that they are pretty close.  These tournaments are another level compared to sophomore nationals. 

About Carr Jr and Courtney;

Harrison, barring disaster, will have the better stats but if they both wrestled as seniors I think Joe would have won.