who do u all think was most deserving of MOW at state?

LUKE ERVIN!

Luke Ervin. He beat the #1 guy (Johnson), #2 guy (Slone), and #4 guy (Lampe) all in route to take the title. Thats one of the toughest draws I'd say and he made alot of people look like fools for saying how overrated he was. I definitely think he should have received it. Justin Davis beat the #9 ranked Isaac Thomas in the finals. And beat the #2,7, and 8 ranked guys. Not as impressive as Luke Ervin's route to victory.

Luke Ervin. He beat the #1 guy (Johnson), #2 guy (Slone), and #4 guy (Lampe) all in route to take the title. Thats one of the toughest draws I'd say and he made alot of people look like fools for saying how overrated he was. I definitely think he should have received it. Justin Davis beat the #9 ranked Isaac Thomas in the finals. And beat the #2,7, and 8 ranked guys. Not as impressive as Luke Ervin's route to victory.

Well said...

john fahy had just as much of a tough ride as luke, yet he made everyone he wrestled look stupid. he beat the number 2, 4, 5, and 6 guys in his weight, and the only one he didnt tech or pin, was the number 2 guy, and that was still a large major. only gave up three points the entire tournament, and those were escapes, he gave the kid.

i say luke also

I have it to Luke, I mean he turned it up and earned his state title.

john fahy had just as much of a tough ride as luke, yet he made everyone he wrestled look stupid. he beat the number 2, 4, 5, and 6 guys in his weight, and the only one he didnt tech or pin, was the number 2 guy, and that was still a large major. only gave up three points the entire tournament, and those were escapes, he gave the kid.

But Fahy was EXPECTED to win. THAT is the big difference. Luke pulled one or two upsets along the way to earn his title, Fahy didn't. And i wouldn't call Fahy's major over Paden big, since Paden went for the "big move" right at the end and got caught. Without that, Fahy only wins 11-3 which is just barely a major.

still a major on the number two kid in the state...can anyone else say they majored the number two kid in the state that won it this year?

The question is this?

What is the MOW? 

I believe it can be three things.

1. Is it the best wrestler that the state of KY offers?

2. The best wrestler at the tourney that day?

3.  The kid that won by upsetting someone else?

My opinion it should go to either the best the state offers or the kid who was the best wrestler at the state tourney. Usually this is the same person.

This year I think you have three different

1.  Would be obviously Harrison Courtney

2.  Would be Justin Davis

3.  Would be Luke Ervin.

The question is this?

What is the MOW? 

I believe it can be three things.

1. Is it the best wrestler that the state of KY offers?

2. The best wrestler at the tourney that day?

3.  The kid that won by upsetting someone else?

My opinion it should go to either the best the state offers or the kid who was the best wrestler at the state tourney. Usually this is the same person.

This year I think you have three different

1.  Would be obviously Harrison Courtney

2.  Would be Justin Davis

3.  Would be Luke Ervin.

well said

who do u all think was most deserving of MOW at state?

This is not to take away from any other wrestler but my vote would go to Jake Bradford. Most people outside of the Ryle Program does not know that Jake gave up his Senior Year playing Football to focus on his wrestling abilities. And let me tell you Jake was one heck of a football player. From being a kid that did not place in the 215 lb weight class a year ago to standing at the top of the podium in the 189 lb weight class this year shows how hard he has worked to be a State Champ in 2009. Just looking at how Jake's body transformed during the last year shows how committed he was. Again not taking away from any other wrestler but I don't think anyone worked/sacrificed  as much as Jake did to get his State Title. Now several College Wrestling Coaches have their eyes on Jake and maybe some more will discover him at Senior Nationals. Congratulations go out to the Ryle Coaching Staff and to Jake on a great season Good Luck at Nationals. 

Ranger's rankings mean nothing at state, so how many ranked kids you beat on your way to the finals is really irrelevant.  Those numbers are just his best guess.

Based on Bulldog-leader's criteria, here's where I'd put them:

1. Is it the best wrestler that the state of KY offers?

Harrison Courtney

Brad Hitchings

Justin Davis

Caleb Ervin

Matt Zarth

2. The best wrestler at the tourney that day?

Justin Davis

Caleb Ervin

Brad Hitchings

Matt Zarth

Harrison Courtney

I agree with Pioneer_Pride rankings are garbage no offense Ranger but some of the people never even meet until the state tournament and if they have never wrestled then how can you tell who is better. 

MOW

DAVIS!

To add to caleb ervin, he was wrestling with a dislocated knee all day saturday he received while warming up with Luke if you could notice by his limping. He had previously injured his knee earlier in the year before the season started. Issac Ervin didnt give up a takedown all year either.

To add to caleb ervin, he was wrestling with a dislocated knee all day saturday he received while warming up with Luke if you could notice by his limping. He had previously injured his knee earlier in the year before the season started. Issac Ervin didnt give up a takedown all year either.

Caleb has always been one of my favorite wrestlers.  I have no doubt he will win an MOW by the time he is done.  But I liked the dislocated knee cap legend the first time i heard it with Caleb when he was an 8th grader.  LOL.  Just kidding, but seriously...I heard he had a dislocated knee cap when he was an 8th grader at m.s. state and needed surgery, and he was limping, etc.  Are you sure it was truly a dislocated knee?  Or is it possible it was just tweaked?  Either way, 63-0, state champ says it all.

Okay josh and pioneer, I have to take offense and disagree that rankings don't mean anything at the state tournament.  While they shouldn't impact the results, when 5 finals matches involve #1 and #2, 4 involve #1 and #3, 1 involves #1 and #4, and a #2 and #3 then I think they give you a pretty good idea who the top dogs are.  Especially when you take into account the draw screws things up a bit.  That being said, I think it does mean something when you have to beat highly ranked wrestlers on the way to a championship.  It shows to some extent who is having a great tournament.  You tell me if a state champ pins his way through a bracket of low ranked kids it is the same as someone who may pin or tech his way through #6 through #2?  No way.  That's not to say that all #2 ranked kids are equal.  Obviously if you have a couple of returning state champs in a weight class it is a bigger deal to beat #2.  I have to believe Davis beating #2 Shotwell on his way to the championship earned him more than a few votes for MOW.

Ranger, picking the finals matches was not really all that tough.  It's ranking the ones below that that is more difficult.  I could have picked 3 or 4 of those finals that had #1 vs #2...maybe all 5.  It's rankings like Najee Calderon ranked 15th, places 6th, Bernard Ray ranked 2nd, DNP, and I'm sure there are more if I cared to look.  If a kid beat Calderon en route to the state finals, you'd say that was nothing...but the kid placed 6th.  That means more to me than what he was ranked prior to state.  I'd be more impressed looking at a bracket and saying "this kid had to beat the guy that placed 2nd, 3rd, & 5th."  I don't care if those guys were ranked or not.  They were the best on that given day.

Ranger, picking the finals matches was not really all that tough.  It's ranking the ones below that that is more difficult.  I could have picked 3 or 4 of those finals that had #1 vs #2...maybe all 5.  It's rankings like Najee Calderon ranked 15th, places 6th, Bernard Ray ranked 2nd, DNP, and I'm sure there are more if I cared to look.  If a kid beat Calderon en route to the state finals, you'd say that was nothing...but the kid placed 6th.  That means more to me than what he was ranked prior to state.  I'd be more impressed looking at a bracket and saying "this kid had to beat the guy that placed 2nd, 3rd, & 5th."  I don't care if those guys were ranked or not.  They were the best on that given day.

good point its the best wrestler who wins on that day

i think it should be the wrestler who was most impressive that day. that doesnt necessarily mean it has to be the one who won.

but thats just my opinion.

i think it should be the wrestler who was most impressive that day. that doesnt necessarily mean it has to be the one who won.

but thats just my opinion.

so are u sayin a state champ doesnt have 2 get mow

so are u sayin a state champ doesnt have 2 get mow

no, i didnt say that.

at all, actually.

i think it should be the wrestler who was most impressive that day. that doesnt necessarily mean it has to be the one who won.

but thats just my opinion.

pwned babe...sorry...

pwned babe...sorry...

but i didnt say it had to be someone who didnt win.

i want you to show me where i said it had to be someone who didnt.

please, thanks.

and jesse didnt say it had to be someone who didnt win...

pwned...again...lol

and jesse didnt say it had to be someone who didnt win...

pwned...again...lol

i quit.

its quite pointless to express my opinion.

obviously.

and jesse didnt say it had to be someone who didnt win...

pwned...again...lol

yeaa

ok babe, no need to get mad...

i do believe that someone could be able to get mow, even if they did not win a state title. although it would be very hard to make a case for them, i mean if you have someone like fahy walk through state, how would you say someone else, who didnt win state would deserve it over him?

i give up.

maybe i worded it wrong.

but i see what you mean.

i give up.

maybe i worded it wrong.

but i see what you mean.

yea thats probly why i was confused sooooo wat exactly do u mean

I want make clear i believe Davis is as equally deserving as any canidate but since he won I am gonna make cases for 5 other wrestlers. These 5 are in no particular order....Matt Zarth 3x state champ and has never won OW he deserves one for his career. Luke Ervin had the best tournament against one of the toughest draws. John Fahy gave up nothing but escapes and won every match with ease. Made highley ranked wrestlers looks silly. Myron Bradbury gave up one total point in 5 matches while pinning 4 opponents and piched a shut out in the finals dominating from every position. Brad Hitchings dominated even tho looking sloppy with technique at times. One of the best high school seasons in KY history considering his 5th place beast finish as a junior. Higher than ruschell and murton as seniors. Congrats to courtney on a great career but he got one last year, lets share the wealth!

yea thats probly why i was confused sooooo wat exactly do u mean

i dont really know anymore actually.

maybe i was wrong.

she thinks it should be given to whoever shows up and wrestles the best at a tournament...but by what criteria does that mean? does that mean who beat the best kids? who dominated the most? who pulled the most upsets? or someone who may have no won his weight, but still wrestled good matches?

all great cases as well 12345

I want make clear i believe Davis is as equally deserving as any canidate but since he won I am gonna make cases for 5 other wrestlers. These 5 are in no particular order....Matt Zarth 3x state champ and has never won OW he deserves one for his career. Luke Ervin had the best tournament against one of the toughest draws. John Fahy gave up nothing but escapes and won every match with ease. Made highley ranked wrestlers looks silly. Myron Bradbury gave up one total point in 5 matches while pinning 4 opponents and piched a shut out in the finals dominating from every position. Brad Hitchings dominated even tho looking sloppy with technique at times. One of the best high school seasons in KY history considering his 5th place beast finish as a junior. Higher than ruschell and murton as seniors. Congrats to courtney on a great career but he got one last year, lets share the wealth!

haha lets share the wealth i bet thats not what he was thinking lol

she thinks it should be given to whoever shows up and wrestles the best at a tournament...but by what criteria does that mean? does that mean who beat the best kids? who dominated the most? who pulled the most upsets? or someone who may have no won his weight, but still wrestled good matches?

all great cases as well 12345

ok thanks 4 clearing that up 4 me

ok thanks 4 clearing that up 4 me

sorry.

wish i could have done a better job of backing up what i said.

sorry.

wish i could have done a better job of backing up what i said.

it's ok babe =) i forgive you.

it's ok babe =) i forgive you.

yeah, thanks.

it's ok babe =) i forgive you.

4get love and basketball lol

Ranger, picking the finals matches was not really all that tough.  It's ranking the ones below that that is more difficult.  I could have picked 3 or 4 of those finals that had #1 vs #2...maybe all 5.  It's rankings like Najee Calderon ranked 15th, places 6th, Bernard Ray ranked 2nd, DNP, and I'm sure there are more if I cared to look.  If a kid beat Calderon en route to the state finals, you'd say that was nothing...but the kid placed 6th.  That means more to me than what he was ranked prior to state.  I'd be more impressed looking at a bracket and saying "this kid had to beat the guy that placed 2nd, 3rd, & 5th."  I don't care if those guys were ranked or not.  They were the best on that given day.

Nothing against Calderon, I've heard lots of good things about him and he will be highly ranked next season, but I guarantee you 99 out of 100 times any 160 in the bracket would take the match against Calderon over Ray.  I could go back over some brackets through the years and find some puds who squeaked through the consolation bracket while some very tough kids beat each other out and didn't place. 

yeah ranger is very right, happens every year.

Nothing against Calderon, I've heard lots of good things about him and he will be highly ranked next season, but I guarantee you 99 out of 100 times any 160 in the bracket would take the match against Calderon over Ray.  I could go back over some brackets through the years and find some puds who squeaked through the consolation bracket while some very tough kids beat each other out and didn't place. 

Probably so, but kids get hot at the right time and just because "any 160 in the bracket" would take that match, doesn't mean it would be the right choice.  Let's try another example then I give.  Last year at 135, Davis was ranked 4th.  He beat #1 ranked Dusty Brown handily.  In that case, who would you rather face...the kid ranked higher or the kid that finished higher?  I swear this is not a trick question.  

Probably so, but kids get hot at the right time and just because "any 160 in the bracket" would take that match, doesn't mean it would be the right choice.  Let's try another example then I give.  Last year at 140, Davis was ranked 4th.  He beat #1 ranked Dusty Brown handily.  In that case, who would you rather face...the kid ranked higher or the kid that finished higher?  I swear this is not a trick question.  

I thought the Larue kid was #1?

Probably so, but kids get hot at the right time and just because "any 160 in the bracket" would take that match, doesn't mean it would be the right choice.  Let's try another example then I give.  Last year at 140, Davis was ranked 4th.  He beat #1 ranked Dusty Brown handily.  In that case, who would you rather face...the kid ranked higher or the kid that finished higher?  I swear this is not a trick question.  

my bad, you're right - it was 135 last year.

davis was awsome last year and he was only a 2 year wrestler, he did handle dusty brown and matt miller pretty well, he was always in control of those matches

Probably so, but kids get hot at the right time and just because "any 160 in the bracket" would take that match, doesn't mean it would be the right choice.  Let's try another example then I give.  Last year at 135, Davis was ranked 4th.  He beat #1 ranked Dusty Brown handily.  In that case, who would you rather face...the kid ranked higher or the kid that finished higher?  I swear this is not a trick question.  

I agree, but those are 2 closely ranked kids.  The top 4 were pretty close in that weight last year.  I thought your point was regarding a "lowly" ranked wrestler who got hot.

Hey pioneer, if you like the guy who beats the highest finishers, then I think it has to go to Luke Ervin.  He beat Slone (2nd), Johnson (3rd), and Lampe (4th).  That likely doesn't happen too often.  Especially one of them being the defending state champ.

I do think that means more than rankings.  I think it's safe to say Ervin did have the hardest way to go as others are trying to point out on this thread.  I still think Davis was MOW by virtue of beating Shotwell who I feel is a better wrestler than the 3 you mentioned...but they are all 3 very tough as well.  I just was most impressed with Davis.  Anyway, it doesn't matter.  I don't get a vote.