I believe this years State Duals is going to be one of the best ones we have seen. There are so many quality teams this year. Anyone have any predictions? Top 4?
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Middle School State Duals
Topic ID: 8129 | 85 Posts
Not going to say any names, but I know a team that has been pretty good all year and appears to be peaking at the right time. Will be hard to beat in E-town.
Not going to say any names, but I know a team that has been pretty good all year and appears to be peaking at the right time. Will be hard to beat in E-town.
Any word on who the 12 teams will be?
District Champs
Union County
North Hardin
River City
North Oldham
Ryle
Campbell County
Elkhorn
McNabb
At Large
Larue County
Oldham County
Turkey Foot
Woodford County
Thanks, I read that list and got excited. Gonna be some stiff competition.District Champs
Union County
North Hardin
River City
North Oldham
Ryle
Campbell County
Elkhorn
McNabb
At Large
Larue County
Oldham County
Turkey Foot
Woodford County
It would be Union Campbell Elkhorn and River City. River City beat out N.O. by 60 points at regionals this past weekend.Union, Campbell, Elkhorn, North Oldham or River City
Why N.O., or River City?
I didn't have the team scores or remember who won that region.
Did N.O. and River City go head to head in a dual? The winner should get the better seed, not based on who did better at Regionals? If I recall, Dual records are what count for state duals?
I didn't have the team scores or remember who won that region.
They went head to head, very early on in the season (I think first tourney for either one) N.O. won by either 2 or 3 points but River City was without Frankrone (most would agree a likely 12 point swing had he been there).Did N.O. and River City go head to head in a dual? The winner should get the better seed, not based on who did better at Regionals? If I recall, Dual records are what count for state duals?
What is the criteria for the pools? Initial release said blind draw. Then it looked like they were discussing regional champs, now we are looking at head to head records. Just curious as to what the standard is.
Did N.O. and River City go head to head in a dual? The winner should get the better seed, not based on who did better at Regionals? If I recall, Dual records are what count for state duals?
Actually, The team with the top team score at each District Tournament is what qualifies them for state duels. Then each region has to vote for who their at large bid team is at regionals. Some Regions vote on it, some vote that the team that places highest at regionals (and wants to go to state duels) will be the at large team from that region.
4 pods of 3, each pod will have a #1 seed - those are the 4 region champs: Union, River City, Campbell, Elkhorn. a blind draw will determine the other 8 spots, I would hope that each pod has 1 region champ, 1 district champ, & 1 at-large team. Seems like the most fair way to spread the talent.
North Oldham and River City split during the regular season. First meetin NO won by a couple of points. Second meeting was at East Oldham. Not sure of the score, but I think River City won it by a larger margin than the earlier duel. Either way, will be good competition this weekend. Should be fun.
North Oldham had quite a few wrestlers not there at East Oldham. They were wrestling with the high school that weekend.So it may have been closer but that doesn't take away River City has a very good team which they showed at the Regionals Saturday.
North Oldham had quite a few wrestlers not there at East Oldham. They were wrestling with the high school that weekend.So it may have been closer but that doesn't take away River City has a very good team which they showed at the Regionals Saturday.
That is a risk you take wrestling up. At one time, there was an understanding that if one competed at HS districts (that's when they had districts) that the wrestler would not compete at middle school. Uh, that didn't last long.
ok call me crazy here
You use a individual tournament to decide entry into a duals tournament
Then use individual points as seeding critera?
here are the downfalls
#1 tournament and dual wrestling are 2 different things
#2 in toyurnament where you can insert multiple entries into one weight class (Scoring or non Scoring) will always benefit the larger programs because if some people fron the same club can place in the same weight classes taking away placement and advancement points from smaller teams, making scoring a wider gap
There r no set of seeding rules. If you are hosting you can implement your own or have the teams involved vote on a set of rules.
Our bylaws state that the 4 Regional Champs will be the #1 seed in each pod at the State Duals. The #1 seeds can change due to illness, injury etc. The rest of the field will be a blind draw seperating school and club teams from the same Region.
Our bylaws state that the 4 Regional Champs will be the #1 seed in each pod at the State Duals. The #1 seeds can change due to illness, injury etc. The rest of the field will be a blind draw seperating school and club teams from the same Region.
When did they adopt the seeding bylaws.
I think Campbell Co or River City will take it this weekend!
Not sure if both had full teams , but union beat both this year .
At Mater Dei the format was very different having 20 different weight classes instead of the normal 15, along with other issues I believe River City forfeited a total of 6 weight classes per dual. More than any other team there (I think the most any other team forfeitedmay have been 2) which doesnt make it a good tourney to base anything on. Not sure about the circumstances of the Campbell Co. dual but they usually bring it this time of year. Dont get me wrong, Union has a great team and I'm sure it will be some great competition but I'm sure the pooling of the teams and which two teams will see eachother in the semis vs the finals will make a big impact on the outcome.I think Campbell Co or River City will take it this weekend!
Not sure if both had full teams , but union beat both this year .
I think Campbell Co or River City will take it this weekend!
Not sure if both had full teams , but union beat both this year .
I know Campbell CO has adjusted their lineup with their lighter weights all dropping down a class. Union is strong in the lower weights as well as Campbell CO. I think Campbell CO's lineup is a lot stronger now with the adjustments. I think they win it.
The state duels tournament is going to be all about the PIN.All of teams have several studs and unless one of them gets upset each team has at least 3 dominate wrestlers.The thing with Rivercity and Campbell most of their toughest kids are in the lower wt. classes.Now Union is kind spread out I can see RC and Campbell opening up a pretty good lead on Union and then Union making a big run to the wire depending on what weight they start at.But the most important thing is the weight class we are not talking about,they are going to determine the outcome.And it will be hugh for coaches to tell them kids how important it is to not get pinned.(and that is alot of pressure on a young wrestler).and this is the part of wrestling I look at as being a team sport.How much is a kid going to give for his team,knowing he can't win, but not getting pinned is a possible victory for his team.It should be exciting.
Campbell Co. has Graziani at 190 Garland at 168 and Downtown at 152 who are all good wrestlers, River City has Calhoun at 168 and Frankrone at 140 who I believe will beat Oxford if they meet at duals. Yes they may be at their strongest at the lower weights but also have talent in other places, I have seen both of these teams build insurmountable leads at the lower weight classes but with the rotation at duals dont forget that the ones who start a dual in the begining usually end up going last in the later duals. Either way it will be a great weekend of wrestling and good luck to all who participate, and lets all pray there are no injuries, saw a good kid get his ankle broke at duals last year and didnt get to participate at state, truly believe he wouldve been a state placer.The state duels tournament is going to be all about the PIN.All of teams have several studs and unless one of them gets upset each team has at least 3 dominate wrestlers.The thing with Rivercity and Campbell most of their toughest kids are in the lower wt. classes.Now Union is kind spread out I can see RC and Campbell opening up a pretty good lead on Union and then Union making a big run to the wire depending on what weight they start at.But the most important thing is the weight class we are not talking about,they are going to determine the outcome.And it will be hugh for coaches to tell them kids how important it is to not get pinned.(and that is alot of pressure on a young wrestler).and this is the part of wrestling I look at as being a team sport.How much is a kid going to give for his team,knowing he can't win, but not getting pinned is a possible victory for his team.It should be exciting.
Campbell Co. has Graziani at 190 Garland at 168 and Downtown at 152 who are all good wrestlers, River City has Calhoun at 168 and Frankrone at 140 who I believe will beat Oxford if they meet at duals. Yes they may be at their strongest at the lower weights but also have talent in other places, I have seen both of these teams build insurmountable leads at the lower weight classes but with the rotation at duals dont forget that the ones who start a dual in the begining usually end up going last in the later duals. Either way it will be a great weekend of wrestling and good luck to all who participate, and lets all pray there are no injuries, saw a good kid get his ankle broke at duals last year and didnt get to participate at state, truly believe he wouldve been a state placer.
What do you think the team score we be Campbell vs Union and River City vs Union. A weight by weight scoring would be nice so we could see the break down
Ha, wish I was that good. Sounds like something a Ranger might be better at than I would. I havent seen enough to make that kind of list and wonder how much kids will be moved around, I know alot of kids changed weight classes for individual state so I wonder what they might wrestle for duals since they are not bound to that weight class like they are bound to it at individual state.What do you think the team score we be Campbell vs Union and River City vs Union. A weight by weight scoring would be nice so we could see the break down
Believe me, I have done that in my preparation for state duals. The only person in this state who prepares as much as I do for state duals is Eddie Paden at Larue. I started preparing a month ago for this weekend. Needless to say, we are coming with high goals.
I think Campbell Co or River City will take it this weekend!
Not sure if both had full teams , but union beat both this year .
River City did not have their full line up! Frankrone beat Oxford by 3 or 4 points while sick as a dog. He had been throwing up minutes before their match had started. Frankrone also had Oxford in near-fall. Long story short, Had River City had their full line-up and Frankrone be healthy the 2 points Union won by may have had a different outcome under normal circumstances!
Louisvillewrestling, I like playing the what-if game as much as the next guy but... Elkhorn lost to River City by 3 at the Oldham super duals. We didn't have our varsity 105 (concussion), our 121 missed weight by .1lb and our 168 lost an incredibly close match to Calhoun. I still recognize that River City beat us that day (even though I can make the internal argument that it could have been different had "blank" been different). If there is one thing I've realized over many years involved in wrestling is that there are no "normal circumstances" on any given Saturday. You are never "full strength" - someone is sick, someone is hurt, someone needs to be out of town, etc.
Lets all hope that every team coming to state duals is healthy and makes weight. Maybe that is the only way we, as opposing parents and coaches, will accept the winning team as actually the winning team.
Good luck everyone this weekend.
That's cool! But I disagree with you! Normal circumstances would be where your whole team is present and healthy(at least not sick) which is usually the case for most teams! I understand someone usually has some sort of minor injury, but River City won all of there duals or meets this year usually under normal circumstances!
River City did not have their full line up! Frankrone beat Oxford by 3 or 4 points while sick as a dog. He had been throwing up minutes before their match had started. Frankrone also had Oxford in near-fall. Long story short, Had River City had their full line-up and Frankrone be healthy the 2 points Union won by may have had a different outcome under normal circumstances!
So how bad does River City beat Union? When they met at Mater Dei it was USA weight classes. Something like 20 weight classes and Union couldn't fill an entire line up ether. It will be settled saturday, good luck everyone. See you saturday.
That's cool! But I disagree with you! Normal circumstances would be where your whole team is present and healthy(at least not sick) which is usually the case for most teams! I understand someone usually has some sort of minor injury, but River City won all of there duals or meets this year usually under normal circumstances!
Has River City only lost to Union this year? Thought they lost to Campbell County at Super Duals.
They did lose to Campbell in the finals of that dual! LOL! I didn't say they won all their tournaments! I simply said that they won or even placed 2nd(LOL) at most of their meets or duals this season with a full & mostly healthy team!
So how bad does River City beat Union? When they met at Mater Dei it was USA weight classes. Something like 20 weight classes and Union couldn't fill an entire line up ether. It will be settled saturday, good luck everyone. See you saturday.
I wouldn't think River City would beat Union real bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think it woulod be a close dual! Or maybe not beat them at at all!
River City also lost a dual to North Hardin at O.C. Super Duals, score was tied but N.H. had one more win, but eventually River City moved on because Fern Creek beat N.H. making it a 3 way tie with R.C. N.H. and F.C. with R.C. having the tie breaker winning criteria.
Any word on which teams are pooled togethor? I also heard they will wrestle back for a true second this year unless that team at 2nd already beat the one at 3rd.
Pool A. - Campbell Co. / Larue / McNabb
Pool B. - River City / Ryle / Woodford Co.
Pool C. - Elkhorn / North Hardin / Oldham Co.
Pool D. - Union / North Oldham / Turkeyfoot
Can someone post the flyer or address and start time to John Hardin High School.
Thanks
Haven't heard about any pools yet, but wrestling the "true" second place match seems so silly to me. At the point in which this match takes place, you have one team coming off of a win, and another team coming off a gut wrenching loss in the finals none the less. Advantage 3rd place team at this point. Now those kids (who earned their way to the finals) have to turn around and wrestle a match that they won't have their heart in. Can you imagine as a spectator how anti climatic this match will be. Everyone gets fired up for the place matches, I don't see anyone firing up for a match after the finals. I've heard of doing this in other sports, but we dont see this in wrestling all year. I wonder how many Coaches who won their 3rd place match would go on and ask for the true 2nd place match, or accept the fact that their team earned 3rd that day and would not put another team through that. I think this is an issue that really needs to be addressed after the season. Just my opinion.
Good points DW. Not to mention you have already wrestled 4 duals on the day and likely ready to just get home. And why put the kids who are preparing for the state tournament through another potentially gruelling match at the end of a long day with the potential for injury.
Thanks Ranger. I understand the thought process behind having the true 2nd place match, I just don't think it has a place in wrestling. Should make for a good discussion at our off season coaches meeting.Good points DW. Not to mention you have already wrestled 4 duals on the day and likely ready to just get home. And why put the kids who are preparing for the state tournament through another potentially gruelling match at the end of a long day with the potential for injury.
Can we vote on this at the coaches meeting. Truth be told we aren't there to see who comes in 2nd, we are there to crown a state champion.
I would assume that since it is in the bylaws, we will abide by it this year. I guess it will be up to the 3rd place team this year to deside whether or not they want to wrestle for 2nd. I would say that we can fix this in the off season.
Well.....the pools came out and the chatter stopped. What's some opinions? Do the pools look even, are the teams split up, etc.? New predictions?
Can't wait until tomorrow, State Duals is great for the kids. Gives them a week to wrestle for something and have fun after two weeks of individual pressure and competition. I am a team sport guy, so the duals are great.
The only thing is, that the strategy is about wiinning the dual, so there tends to be more moving around of kids to fill spots and gain max points. Sometimes takes away from seeing a state tourney preview match.
Depending on the way things fall tomorrow, could see some great matchups.
Many of the weights have upwards of four or five of the State Title “Contenders”
Using Ranger’s List (Thanks Ranger)
- 80 Pounds is loaded and I think will be the most entertaining of the day. Hope no one counts out Jacobs just yet. I like his aggression in big matches.
Wells, Krasieg, Jacobs, Ervin, Roberts
- 140 Can Anyone Challenge Frankrone? Has only been tested once this year and that was by Oxford @ Mater Dei
Frankrone, Oxford, Hayden, Cornett, Nickols
- 168 Always fun to watch the bigger kids .This one is wide open IMHO.
McIntosh, Calhoun, Anderson, Sherman
Others That Should Be Interesting
- 105 Erdman vs. Emerson if it Were to Happen. I think Logan is unbeatable, but have watched Brady find a way time and time again.
- 98 Oxford & Miles I think Oxford is the Best of the Weight Class from what I have witnessed. Good match between the two @ Mater Dei with Oxford winning by 1.
- 86 Chaffe & Cook in Pool B. Cook is my sleeper pick for a State Title.
I agree with the comment about cook. He was big at 92lbs. He has to look like a giant at 86.
Cook is a big kid but someone tell me how Bindner made 92? Doesnt seem right hes huge compared to the rest of the crew, hope there doing it right or it can seriously mess him up for his future.
I guess they thought binder would have an easier time at state going 92lbs. There are many kids in that bracket that nobody seems to know about. I wouldnt be surprised if we see an upset. You never know who's going to show up. We will see who wants it more. Either way it should be a fun bracket to watch
I guess they thought binder would have an easier time at state going 92lbs. There are many kids in that bracket that nobody seems to know about. I wouldnt be surprised if we see an upset. You never know who's going to show up. We will see who wants it more. Either way it should be a fun bracket to watch
Belive Bindner wouldve had his hands full with the kids at 98 there alot bigger than him, I dont see anyone touching him at 92 Period, wont be nearly as much fun as the 105lb class, you must have a kid or know a kid in that weight class, they better be on their A game to even keep it close with him. Same as Erdman I belive he will totally dominate the weight class, he is by far the most improved middle schooler we have up here. Good Luck to all should be a fun weekend to say the least!
I agree that erdman is tough as nails. I also believe that emerson is a stud himself. It just drives me crazy when I read post saying nobody has a chance against certain kids. I have seen multiple upsets over the years. Point being is the kids in this state are really working hard and the talent is getting tougher every year. I hope we get to the point as a state where we have 30 yenter's, wiley's,binder's,ervin's,etc. I love to see the top kids battle it out. Good luck to them all
I agree that erdman is tough as nails. I also believe that emerson is a stud himself. It just drives me crazy when I read post saying nobody has a chance against certain kids. I have seen multiple upsets over the years. Point being is the kids in this state are really working hard and the talent is getting tougher every year. I hope we get to the point as a state where we have 30 yenter's, wiley's,binder's,ervin's,etc. I love to see the top kids battle it out. Good luck to them all
I agree with you on that but I believe if Bindner shows up he will Walk pretty easily as well as Erdman. As long as your on the mat you have a chance, the best must overcome all adversity and pressure and pull it out. Guess will see what happens next weekend.
Only a couple of hiccups on the day (Elkhorn's bus issue and the timing issue between the 2 gyms). Overall a great day. Coach Mitchell and the folks at John Hardin ran a great event and there was some amazing wrestling (and I didn't even get to see the CD Pool gym). KY Middle School wrestling is awesome!
Glad to read someone actually ran a good tournament.... I know many others are run well; but, it seems the only post are always negative about how long it runs, the computer, concession, this or that.....Only a couple of hiccups on the day (Elkhorn's bus issue and the timing issue between the 2 gyms). Overall a great day. Coach Mitchell and the folks at John Hardin ran a great event and there was some amazing wrestling (and I didn't even get to see the CD Pool gym). KY Middle School wrestling is awesome!
If Ranger says it was well run event, it must have been pretty good...Hats of to Coach Mitchell and the folks at John Hardin.
After last weeks regionals this week was what we needed. We are new to wrestling but were very pleased how the tournament for teams was ran. We were also very impressed with the school, it was a beautiful school with quite a few architectural designs built into it. Overall a good time and even better time afterwards when we met up to have dinner and celebrate the day.
1st Campbell Co. 2nd River City 3rd North Hardin 4th North Oldham. I'm actually glad they wrestled back for second. Campbell and River City were absolutely the two best teams there and had an awesome dual in the semis. I know Union and North Oldham also had a great dual that came down to the last match, alot of people there were suprised when N.O. won, just shows you better not look past no one. Great tournament, well ran.
John Hardin did a great job of putting on the tournament. Congratulations To Campbell on winning their 2nd strait state dual title. The one thing i would like to see in the future is all four mats in one gym. It makes for a great atmosphere when you get to see all four pools at once. Just my opinion and would like to see it in the bylaws.
Congrats to Campbell Co. from River City. That was a battle. The excitement was great, and the kids rose to the occasion with their performances. Good luck to all at State.
Keegan Duncan beat Robert smith at 121 6-5 or 7-6 match went to the wire . Could have went either way
Keegan Duncan beat Robert smith at 121 6-5 or 7-6 match went to the wire . Could have went either way
I agree! Possibly one of the top 3 matches of the day! This match was tied with 30 secs left. 6-5 Duncan.
Congratulations to all the wrestlers on a good year. I would also like to thank our Own Coach Kyle and the other men who devoted their time into making this first year not only a good year as far as wrestling but a time to learn life lessons that will stay with young men throughout their lives. They are always there to help our children as well as us rookie parents with a myriad of problems. I know I didn't call the others by their names but that does not lessen their importance to the team, nor does it tell of their sacrifice of time to the sport. We pray that all goes well tomorrow and that all wrestlers and their families have safe travels to and from the tournament without any serious injuries. Thanks again for a great year and one other thing .....Go NORTH. Good luck everyone tomorrow.
Thanks,
Mike