After looking at the youth state roster I see that coaches and clubs cant seem to tell the real weight of a wrestler. This doesn't benefit your youth wrestler by wrestling him/her in a bracket that they are to big for. It hurts them more then anything! If we want Kentucky to be able to compete with other state like Ohio and Tennessee then we have to first be able to tell the truth about what a kids real weight is. Our regionals was a joke really a Joke. We need weight checks at state or its just another tournament it needs to be official more controlled if you will because it seems that coaches even at this stage (youth wrestling) can't be honest.

 

completely agree  it`s not any trouble to do the weight classes in 5lb increments

What region are you referring to?  Can you PM me who might be fudging their weights?  For the record, we are bringing a scale to spot check wrestlers as they receive their medals.  I'd hate to be a coach who got caught. 

completely agree  it`s not any trouble to do the weight classes in 5lb increments

Yes it is.  W/out qualifiers, we'd have some brackets of 70+ kids.  You send me a format of a state/tournament you'd prefer, and I'll run the #'s.  This was done in the fall using USA, Ohio Tournament of Champions, Indiana, and a WV tournament.  The results were ugly. 

miss understood yes you do need regional tournaments to qualifie the kids.

i would rather the weight classes be  45,50, 55,60 ect. instead of the 10% rule.

the heavier you get the bigger the difference

How exactly are brackets established? Seems like no rhyme or reason in them. There are kids with 3 (5%) pounds difference in same bracket. Why not go straight down weights??

by birth year & weight look at aau classes in tenn.

Wasn't meaning how others do it. Meant how were ours for this year done. Just don't have great interpretation skills.

they are not doing weigh ins sunday morning.

weigh ins were done between feb.2- feb.10

then sent in with registration.

your going to have (cheating) on the scales the only way around that is to have a weigh in. I know with this many kids it would be nearly impossible to do the of day of the event. I will not blast any one school or club on here. My sons weight is always between 50 to 53 pounds. Myself I have no reason to lie about his weight it would only be cheating him in the long run.  Coaches that lie about a kids weight are punishing the kid in the long run just to be able to say for personal gain that they had so many kids from the club to place at state. That my friends is sorry....

If you have to qualify with set weight classes this cuts down on a lot of the scale time.  Brackets are set you have alt's. if a kid bust on weight his tournament is over.  Its not that hard.  We have kids weigh in 10 days before a tournament this is crazy.  Everyone is a winner is also a crazy way to run a State Tournament.

If you have to qualify with set weight classes this cuts down on a lot of the scale time.  Brackets are set you have alt's. if a kid bust on weight his tournament is over.  Its not that hard.  We have kids weigh in 10 days before a tournament this is crazy.  Everyone is a winner is also a crazy way to run a State Tournament.

sounds pretty simple don't it..? Know I now how some of these kids win so much...because they are wrestling kids smaller then them all the time. I agree you should have to qualify for state just like the middle and high school level because that is what these young kids are working towards.

it is crazy anyone commited to the sport doesn`t mind getting up early to do weigh ins .

it`s just part of it as for 8 man brackets i guess to many little johnnys aren`t winng enough.

it is the state tournament there should be just one winner for the weight & age groups

I agree 100% kids don't know how to lose. all youth sports are set up this way I agree it should be fun but a kid needs to learn how to lose. This is why kids give up on sports they are always winners when they get to a higher level and lose they can't handle it and they just drop out of sports. If they are serious to the sport then they have got to start learning the ins and outs of it and weigh ins are a big part of. Now I don't think at this age we should worry about a kids weight kids should not be cutting weight or anything like that but should be learning how to eat healthy and exercise.

There is always a complaint about someone's weight but I have never seen anyone at state get called out for it. If you think someone is over why not ask for a spot check before the match? Best way to stop it is to catch them in the act!!

I've never seen it happen at state, but when I've seen weight challenges throughout the season, I've never seen the kid disqualified. Even if the kid is over by a few pounds, the argument is always there - we weighed after a hard practice; he had a birthday party yesterday and ate lots of cake; he had a big breakfast. With weighing 10-14 days before a tourney, you can't fairly check weight. Kids fluctuate a lot. I've been having my son watch what he's eating and drinking the last two days because he's wrestling in the second session after breakfast and lunch. I would hate for him to be over, but at the same time, it probably doesn't matter because they would still let him wrestle. There is no guideline/cutoff for a weight check. It's not fair to either kid because the kids whose weights are listed low aren't the ones who sent in the roster; the coach did. Weigh ins at regionals and state is the only solution.

I've never seen it happen at state, but when I've seen weight challenges throughout the season, I've never seen the kid disqualified. Even if the kid is over by a few pounds, the argument is always there - we weighed after a hard practice; he had a birthday party yesterday and ate lots of cake; he had a big breakfast. With weighing 10-14 days before a tourney, you can't fairly check weight. Kids fluctuate a lot. I've been having my son watch what he's eating and drinking the last two days because he's wrestling in the second session after breakfast and lunch. I would hate for him to be over, but at the same time, it probably doesn't matter because they would still let him wrestle. There is no guideline/cutoff for a weight check. It's not fair to either kid because the kids whose weights are listed low aren't the ones who sent in the roster; the coach did. Weigh ins at regionals and state is the only solution.

Amen

what would it take to change how they do the weigh ins

I agree with the argument being there but seriously how much can these kids be packing on in 10 days? I would think it'd be hard for anybody under 100 to pack on over 5lbs in 10 days unless they're trying too. Weigh ins day of is the perfect solution but is it that bad that we need to resort to that. Last year was one of the fastest state tourney that I can remember. I would hate to lengthened it by several hours because of a coach(es) that stretch the truth. What Im getting at is proof that it is actually happening.

85mc, attend the youth meetings and convince everyone to change it.

I agree with the argument being there but seriously how much can these kids be packing on in 10 days? I would think it'd be hard for anybody under 100 to pack on over 5lbs in 10 days unless they're trying too. Weigh ins day of is the perfect solution but is it that bad that we need to resort to that. Last year was one of the fastest state tourney that I can remember. I would hate to lengthened it by several hours because of a coach(es) that stretch the truth. What Im getting at is proof that it is actually happening.

85mc, attend the youth meetings and convince everyone to change it.

I think many coaches are hesitant to ask for a weight check because the opposing coach often gets hostile and the hosting team still allows the kid to wrestle. If we are going to say weight checks are an option, then there needs to be a clear definition of what is allowed. Does the kid have to make the weight listed, one pound allowance, 2 pounds? Right now, it's very subjective. We need to have clear cut guidelines if we aren't doing weigh ins.

After looking at the youth state roster I see that coaches and clubs cant seem to tell the real weight of a wrestler. This doesn't benefit your youth wrestler by wrestling him/her in a bracket that they are to big for. It hurts them more then anything! If we want Kentucky to be able to compete with other state like Ohio and Tennessee then we have to first be able to tell the truth about what a kids real weight is. Our regionals was a joke really a Joke. We need weight checks at state or its just another tournament it needs to be official more controlled if you will because it seems that coaches even at this stage (youth wrestling) can't be honest.

Where can a copy of the youth state Rosters be seen?

If you have to qualify with set weight classes this cuts down on a lot of the scale time.  Brackets are set you have alt's. if a kid bust on weight his tournament is over.  Its not that hard.  We have kids weigh in 10 days before a tournament this is crazy.  Everyone is a winner is also a crazy way to run a State Tournament.

Weight classes = weight cutting....this is a broken record. We should do whatever we can to prevent it at youth, regardless of what other states or tournaments do. Telling a youth kid who weighs .1 lbs over a weight that he can't wrestle will guarantee weight cutting and discourage youth kids and families from our sport. Not everyone is a winner. Almost every bracket is a full 8 man bracket. So there will be 7 "losers" in every bracket. For all of you who want qualifying tournaments, have you thought about the fact that if you do that you are virtually eliminating the possibility of having the tournament at Alltech? In my opinion, having it there the day after the high school tournament is priceless and is about the only thing that makes this tournament special. Winning a youth state tournament in Kentucky (or any state for that matter) is not and will never be prestigious. Quit acting like it should be set up like middle or high school! Some of these kids are 6 years old. Make it cool and fun and they'll keep coming back and our state will continue to grow at the youth level.

After looking at the youth state roster I see that coaches and clubs cant seem to tell the real weight of a wrestler. This doesn't benefit your youth wrestler by wrestling him/her in a bracket that they are to big for. It hurts them more then anything! If we want Kentucky to be able to compete with other state like Ohio and Tennessee then we have to first be able to tell the truth about what a kids real weight is. Our regionals was a joke really a Joke. We need weight checks at state or its just another tournament it needs to be official more controlled if you will because it seems that coaches even at this stage (youth wrestling) can't be honest.

Tennessee....really?

I don't think that any kid is packing on any weight. I think that the weight is not true from the beginning. I think we as coaches are putting these kids out on the mat to compete and to learn the sport of wrestling and to be fair and honest. If you have a kid that weighs 55 pounds but you say he weighs 53 that's not fair to either kid or the sport. If the kid weighs 55 to 60 pounds and you slate him in at a lower weight and he crushes the kids in that bracket what has he learned NOTHING. It also takes away from the kids that got crushed. I hate to challenge a weight but Sunday I will challenge a kids weight because I know he weighs more then what he has been slated in at..

Sbfraz, your right there should be a clear definition of it. Probably nothing could be done for this state but this is something that could easily be fixed before 2014.

Not to change the subject but looking at the bylaws which were posted alot needs to be updated and discussed!!

Raidercoach, I agree the altech is by far the best venue our youth state has seen and qualifying would reduce the numbers greatly eliminating our chance to stay there.

Tennessee....really?

yeah tennessee

I don't think that any kid is packing on any weight. I think that the weight is not true from the beginning. I think we as coaches are putting these kids out on the mat to compete and to learn the sport of wrestling and to be fair and honest. If you have a kid that weighs 55 pounds but you say he weighs 53 that's not fair to either kid or the sport. If the kid weighs 55 to 60 pounds and you slate him in at a lower weight and he crushes the kids in that bracket what has he learned NOTHING. It also takes away from the kids that got crushed. I hate to challenge a weight but Sunday I will challenge a kids weight because I know he weighs more then what he has been slated in at..

You absolutely must challenge a kid if you are confident he is over weight. We need to expose the "cheaters". Our region weighs in as a region. It's a legit weigh in, granted it is over a week before state so I'm sure there is some fluctuation, but there is no cheating.

yeah tennessee

Tennessee is far from the top echelon of wrestling. I doubt many believe they are much better than Kentucky if at all.

We will be checking the medalists as they wait in line on Sunday. I agree that it is not the kids that are cheating but the coaches submitting the weights/rosters. And if there are issues my guess is there will be consistent issues for certain teams/clubs. And we need to expose them and implement processes to address this in the future. And maybe we will find that in general everything is fine and weights are okay.

Ok so a kid places 1st he beat everyone he was up against what will happen if he is over the weight bracket. Can we challenge before the match ever takes place.

Ok so a kid places 1st he beat everyone he was up against what will happen if he is over the weight bracket. Can we challenge before the match ever takes place.

Pinned,

I don't know you or who you are suspecting, but if you have evidence of a kid or kids that you feel are overweight, I suggest you PM Mlee or Ranger and I'm sure they can ask that kid's coach for a challenge before wrestling begins.

We will be checking the medalists as they wait in line on Sunday. I agree that it is not the kids that are cheating but the coaches submitting the weights/rosters. And if there are issues my guess is there will be consistent issues for certain teams/clubs. And we need to expose them and implement processes to address this in the future. And maybe we will find that in general everything is fine and weights are okay.

This is great Ranger....I'm going to pull up a chair and grab some popcorn to watch this. I sure hope coaches read this board and are aware of this, otherwise there could be some fireworks at the podium.

For all of you who want qualifying tournaments, have you thought about the fact that if you do that you are virtually eliminating the possibility of having the tournament at Alltech? In my opinion, having it there the day after the high school tournament is priceless and is about the only thing that makes this tournament special. Winning a youth state tournament in Kentucky (or any state for that matter) is not and will never be prestigious. Quit acting like it should be set up like middle or high school! Some of these kids are 6 years old. Make it cool and fun and they'll keep coming back and our state will continue to grow at the youth level.

 

 

I found this from AAU Nationals 16 man brackets with set weights you will have over 1000 kids.  I'm not sure what the numbers are just thinking they can't be much higher than this.

 

TOTS: (BORN AFTER 2007) 

35, 40, 45, 50, 55, HWT

BANTAM (BORN 2005-06)   

40, 45, 50, 55, 60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 90, HWT

MIDGET (BORN 2003-04)     

50, 55, 60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 103, 112, 120, 130, HWT   

NOVICE: (BORN 2001-02)

60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100, 105, 112, 120, 130, 140, HWT

MIDDLE SCHOOL: (BORN IN 1998, 1999, 2000)

70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100, 105, 110, 115, 120, 125, 130, 140, 150, 160, 180, HWT

I found this from AAU Nationals 16 man brackets with set weights you will have over 1000 kids. I'm not sure what the numbers are just thinking they can't be much higher than this.

TOTS: (BORN AFTER 2007)

35, 40, 45, 50, 55, HWT

BANTAM (BORN 2005-06)

40, 45, 50, 55, 60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 90, HWT

MIDGET (BORN 2003-04)

50, 55, 60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 103, 112, 120, 130, HWT

NOVICE: (BORN 2001-02)

60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100, 105, 112, 120, 130, 140, HWT

MIDDLE SCHOOL: (BORN IN 1998, 1999, 2000)

70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100, 105, 110, 115, 120, 125, 130, 140, 150, 160, 180, HWT

We ran the numbers using these weight classes with the kids we had last year and the big problem you have is you would HAVE to have a qualifying tournament. Which is fine if you want to have the state tournament in a middle school gym.

Is it an option to hold Middle School the same day as youth?  As much as I like my boy wrestling Middle School this would limit youth at the Middle School level.  Alltech holds 10-12 mats and it brings the whole state to one site in one weekend.  

 

MIDDLE SCHOOL: (BORN IN 1998, 1999, 2000)

70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100, 105, 110, 115, 120, 125, 130, 140, 150, 160, 180, HWT

Is it an option to hold Middle School the same day as youth? As much as I like my boy wrestling Middle School this would limit youth at the Middle School level. Alltech holds 10-12 mats and it brings the whole state to one site in one weekend.

MIDDLE SCHOOL: (BORN IN 1998, 1999, 2000)

70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100, 105, 110, 115, 120, 125, 130, 140, 150, 160, 180, HWT

I believe we need to keep youth separate. The goal of youth wrestling should be to introduce the sport to kids and families and make them want to come back. If we try to make it as intense and pressure-packed as middle and high school, I think we'd hurt ourselves. If you have some stud youth kids and want more competition you can easily get it by wrestling up at middle, going to camps, etc. We have to keep in mind that we have very different goals as an association at the youth level compared to middle. So combining the two could have bad consequences. I know some people want our youth tournament to be like Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome, but keep in mind we have some very young kids out there.

I I know some people want our youth tournament to be like Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome, but keep in mind we have some very young kids out there.

 

I'm not looking for Mad Max.  I just believe If you are going to call it Youth State it should be just that.  Our product is watered down.

I agree with Chris Duke on this kids have the option to compete or not to compete. This is my sons first year of competing I held him out last year from competing because I didn't want to crush his spirit. We have to leave it to the parents on this if they think the child should be competing then they should do just that. I think more then any thing its about the money that this brings in. Wrestling is a intense sport! Two kids on the mat one weighs 50 pounds the other 60 that's a huge advantage it should and needs to be fair bottom line. Some of these kids that really not that good but have 2 or 3 " 1st place state finishes" well wonder why maybe its because the kid out ways everyone in his/her bracket. Its bull and it need to be looked at in the perfect world everyone would be honest but we are not in a perfect world. This will hurt the sport more then anything. wrestling is growing at a rapid pace we need to step up our game.

Doesn't every region wiegh in together like we do for state? Everyone in our region went to CC to wiegh in together so there is no cheating. Both my boys have consistantly wieghed with in 5 pounds each week. One weighed between stayed between 76 to 79 and the other 82 to 84. I do agree that weighing in 2 weeks before state is a little early. But I don't have an answer. I also know there is some people that bust their butts for this sport and they hear a lot of complaining. Id like to thank them for the work that they put in.

Some regions are very spread out so they don't weigh in together. I know some schools have to travel about 2 hours to their regional so it gets difficult.

I agree with Chris Duke on this kids have the option to compete or not to compete. This is my sons first year of competing I held him out last year from competing because I didn't want to crush his spirit. We have to leave it to the parents on this if they think the child should be competing then they should do just that. I think more then any thing its about the money that this brings in. Wrestling is a intense sport! Two kids on the mat one weighs 50 pounds the other 60 that's a huge advantage it should and needs to be fair bottom line. Some of these kids that really not that good but have 2 or 3 " 1st place state finishes" well wonder why maybe its because the kid out ways everyone in his/her bracket. Its bull and it need to be looked at in the perfect world everyone would be honest but we are not in a perfect world. This will hurt the sport more then anything. wrestling is growing at a rapid pace we need to step up our game.

You clearly are focusing in on one kid that you know around your kids weight. Like was said earlier, you can challenge their weight at the tournament and they will be weighed if they medal.

I'm not looking for Mad Max. I just believe If you are going to call it Youth State it should be just that. Our product is watered down.

Our high school state is watered down. You are not going to get elite competition in Kentucky at ANY level. If you want it, it's not hard to find it. You live in NKY, as you already know, if you cross the river you can get all the competition you want.

How exactly are brackets established? Seems like no rhyme or reason in them. There are kids with 3 (5%) pounds difference in same bracket. Why not go straight down weights??

The brackets are done using a software designed by a youth coach from Ohio.  Once all rosters are entered, the software sorts in 8 man brackets by age group and weight starting from smallest to largest and not exceeding 10% weight spread.  The lack of "ryhme or reason" is contributed to a function of separating kids from the same club.  For instance, if a team had multiple kids the same age and weight, the software will separate if and only if the bracket is w/in the 10% rule and age group.  This will create an overlap in weight classes.  Personally, I love this function.  Who wants to go to "state" and watch a bracket of 5 kids from the same team?  2 years ago (before this upgrade to the software was added) there were 3 brackets where all 8 kids were from the same team! 

We will be checking the medalists as they wait in line on Sunday. I agree that it is not the kids that are cheating but the coaches submitting the weights/rosters. And if there are issues my guess is there will be consistent issues for certain teams/clubs. And we need to expose them and implement processes to address this in the future. And maybe we will find that in general everything is fine and weights are okay.

You'd better have a good reason if you try to weighin Youth region 2 kids. We all battled rush hour to get to St X to do weigh ins and birth certificate checks. Evidently we were the only ones doing this. Why aren't the other regions?

You'd better have a good reason if you try to weighin Youth region 2 kids. We all battled rush hour to get to St X to do weigh ins and birth certificate checks. Evidently we were the only ones doing this. Why aren't the other regions?

I think the point is to weigh in all the kids that placed. Why would anyone have a problem with this?

In my opinion there's a higher likelihood of false ages being given. I've seen one team consistently enter 12 year old, 7th grade girls in the 10 and under divisions.

What is your allowance gonna be? 2lbs or 5%???? The problem is you have no rules in place and now you are gonna make them up as you go. That will be a tough sell. Don't ruin a good thing because someone is mad over a kid. This needs to be addressed but 2 days before is not the time.

I think the point is to weigh in all the kids that placed. Why would anyone have a problem with this?

The only problem I have is what are the rules here? If a kid is .5 heavier is that ok? If a kid is 5 lbs heavier what is the impact? We already weighed in once. We told our parents there were no more weighins. Now because Ranger says so we are weighing then in again?

What about birth certificates? EQ mentioned at the Region 2 tournament during the coaches meeting that other regions weren't checking them.

I'm not against the weight checks. Lets do it. Lets also check birth certificates. I just want to know what the rules are here. If the bracket is 110-118 and a kid who was entered at 112 weighs 117 is that OK? If so, how is that any more fair than the 118 lb kid who check in at 123 at the medal ceremony?

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

I think many coaches are hesitant to ask for a weight check because the opposing coach often gets hostile and the hosting team still allows the kid to wrestle. If we are going to say weight checks are an option, then there needs to be a clear definition of what is allowed. Does the kid have to make the weight listed, one pound allowance, 2 pounds? Right now, it's very subjective. We need to have clear cut guidelines if we aren't doing weigh ins.

Can't have clear guidelines without clear weight classes. Not trying to be counter productive, just stating my opinion. Sbfraz, this isn't a post knocking what you said. Its taking what you said, agreeing, then expanding.

Weight classes = weight cutting....this is a broken record. We should do whatever we can to prevent it at youth, regardless of what other states or tournaments do. Telling a youth kid who weighs .1 lbs over a weight that he can't wrestle will guarantee weight cutting and discourage youth kids and families from our sport.Not everyone is a winner. Almost every bracket is a full 8 man bracket. So there will be 7 "losers" in every bracket.For all of you who want qualifying tournaments, have you thought about the fact that if you do that you are virtually eliminating the possibility of having the tournament at Alltech? In my opinion, having it there the day after the high school tournament is priceless and is about the only thing that makes this tournament special. Winning a youth state tournament in Kentucky (or any state for that matter) is not and will never be prestigious. Quit acting like it should be set up like middle or high school! Some of these kids are 6 years old. Make it cool and fun and they'll keep coming back and our state will continue to grow at the youth level.

If we are not trying to set this up like the middle school and high school state tournament, why is it so important to have it Alltech? (I know that the middle school state is held elsewhere) I dislike that set up for high school, so it wouldn't hurt my feelings at all to have the youth tournament somewhere else. Why put the youth on the same level "Alltech" as the high school? I respectfully, disagree. True weight classes, weigh ins, and qualifying tournaments, that's wrestling.

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

I think a lot of people have made some great suggestions. I think at last youth meeting they came up with the idea to take all the placers and put together a tournament after the state tournament. That should put to rest who the real state champion is. I went to two youth practices recently and talked to multiple kids. I asked them if they were going to win a title. Most of their faces lit up and the response was "yes". The point is that an 8 year kid is excited to win the tournament. Regardless if the adults are arguing that it is not a true state title. I say let them be kids and be excited to win a title.

As far as weight classes I think this will be addressed at the new season ending tournament. The big problem is the parents cutting little Johnny down from 54 to 50lbs when the kid is 8 years old. That's a problem. I remember doing regional weigh ins a few years ago and a parent told me his 7 year old stayed home from school and ran all day prior to weigh ins. Wow. I thought what is wrong with people.

I can say as a parent and coach I can remember when my son won his first youth title. The excitement for him was indescribable. He ended up winning 3 total and none of the compared to the first. Now that he is in middle school he understands what it takes just to make it to state. The point is that in the moment of his first title he didn't get his medal and say "I'm not the true champion". They have plenty of time to work and battle to make it to state and hopefully win a middle school title or high school title. Let them be kids. I can tell you it gets tougher the older they get. That so called title might be the only one they ever get. Mine is still hoping to get a middle school title. Maybe one day he will. Lol.

Good luck to all the youth kids Sunday. When all the kids climb up on that podium to get their medal look at their faces. Let me know if the kids care they are not the "true state champion"

Well said

If we are not trying to set this up like the middle school and high school state tournament, why is it so important to have it Alltech? (I know that the middle school state is held elsewhere) I dislike that set up for high school, so it wouldn't hurt my feelings at all to have the youth tournament somewhere else. Why put the youth on the same level "Alltech" as the high school? I respectfully, disagree. True weight classes, weigh ins, and qualifying tournaments, that's wrestling.

Having it at Alltech encourages youth families to attend the high school tournament on Saturday. Seeing our state's best high school kids and the spectacle of the finals is the best advertisement our state can offer to keep kids and families interested in wrestling.

I know many disagree, but having true weight classes will encourage weight cutting AND create problems distributing the competition. We'd have to have about 4 70lb brackets with weight classes. If that's the case, can those kids really call themselves a "true" 70 lb champ? Absolutely not. The best part of the 10% rule, aside from discouraging weight cutting, is it allows the tournament directors to spread the competition so every bracket is full. Otherwise, we'd have a huge log jam at some weights and half full brackets in many others. We've crunched the numbers many times and there is no avoiding it with weight classes. I think next year we move to 16 man brackets and continue the 10% rule. That makes the brackets a lot more competitive.

This topic was not meant to bash youth wrestling I tip my hat to the many people that set all these tournaments up and to the people that put in the many hours away from family to try and make this sport top notch. We have to make coaches and teams more accountable for not telling the truth but we have to have rules in place to be able to do this. we need weight classes we need regionals to mean something a kid should have to wrestle his way into state. we could also have the state tournament open for those kids that didn't place at regionals just not in the same brackets as our kids that placed at regionals. I don't know what the answer is like I said I give all the respect in the world to the ones that are over this. I would like to see a true state champ at the youth level my kid I don't think is that advanced yet but I want him to have a fair chance to place as high as his ability will allow him. That is all I am saying and this is not over just one kid its about all the kids it should be a fair shake for all the young wrestlers in the state.

Nobody has said what the criteria for the weight checks at the podium will be. My son is two pounds lighter than the biggest kid in his bracket, so can he load up at dinner tonight or do we need to watch it like we usually do? I know it's silly, but seriously, if you are going to do this, some guidelines need to be set.

I'm all for weight checks/weigh ins, but I can't imagine that this will be well received tomorrow since there was no advance notice and most weigh ins were at 9 am a week ago. The afternoon kids will eat breakfast, lunch and healthy snacks to keep up energy during the tourney. Even very honest/legitimate weights have the potential to be off by a few pounds. This could be very interesting to watch:)

Sbfraz, As far as i know they're just checking weights to compare from what was actually sent in. No consequences toward the wrestlers.

Where can you find the brackets?

In reference to all the hoopla about true weight classes and true state champions at the youth level, some people have brought up some good points and many others ridiculous. Seems that too many parents are so worried about their child losing or not being viewed by their own adult friends as a winner has driven some to point fingers at others. Raidercoach is the only one that has said numerous times that this is for the kids. I can remember a few years back the youth state tournament being held at Fern Creek High School.  The tournament was handled nicely but the kids did not walk into that venue and have that little bit of WOW factor as walking into Alltech or Frankfort for that matter. If a coach is sending in false weights then that is totally on him/her and should be dealt with accordingly.  Most of us know throughout the season which kids are close to ours in weight in our own region. If a coach needs to fudge a childs weight for glory then maybe he/she is not that good of a coach afterall.  I like the idea of all kids wrestling regionals and advancing to state regardless of wins and losses.  At this age many of the kids are far more superior than others and that is totally okay.  There are more parents that leave tournaments feeling like losers and winners than kids. If singling out kids at the elementary levels is the answer, then how would people feel about that applying to other sports? Maybe we should suggest to all the local baseball organizations to do away with T-Ball. If the 4,5, or 6 year old can't hit a live pitch then baseball is not gonna be his/her sport. All kids deserve the opportunity to grow and us as adults have to learn to accept the losing and winning as easy as they do.  Our job as parents and coaches is not to drive our kids to reach goals that we could or couldn't, but to teach them how to be an adult as we watch them grow.  And just so you know, my child has wrestled up in weight most of the season and done quite well.  There are a few kids that are 10-15 lbs lighter than him that he can't handle.  IMO weight is not quite as important as most make it out. For example, Bobby Bryant from Trinity won the 285 lb class.  He weighs 220 lbs.

You absolutely must challenge a kid if you are confident he is over weight. We need to expose the "cheaters". Our region weighs in as a region. It's a legit weigh in, granted it is over a week before state so I'm sure there is some fluctuation, but there is no cheating.

Tennessee is far from the top echelon of wrestling. I doubt many believe they are much better than Kentucky if at all.

Tennessee has a pretty good AAU system IMO.  You weigh in for every tournament and they are all on trackwrestling.  We have a TOP 100 series with 4-5 tournaments spead out across the state that brings in much of our state's top talent.  You sign up for our Saturday tournaments on trackwrestling by midnight Thursday night and physically weigh in the day of the tournament.  If the kid is over weight then you can pay a bump up fee to be placed in the appropriate bracket.  All of our weigh ins for the TOP 100, Regional and State tournaments are conducted on Friday evening at satellite weighin sights. A referee is present at each weigh in site to conduct and certify the weighins.   All the TOP 100, Regional, and State tournaments also use the dashboard on trackwrestling for near immediate results.  We do have one TOP 100 tournament left for the season which takes place this Saturday, FEB 23 near Knoxville.  Some in KY already visit us often.  This would be a great chance to see another way of doing things and possibly even find some competition by heading south instead of north.  

We will be checking the medalists as they wait in line on Sunday. I agree that it is not the kids that are cheating but the coaches submitting the weights/rosters. And if there are issues my guess is there will be consistent issues for certain teams/clubs. And we need to expose them and implement processes to address this in the future. And maybe we will find that in general everything is fine and weights are okay.

Here's my problem with this. When the kids got there medals today(evening session) they were wearing 4lbs of cloths at least counting there singlets, shoes, shorts, shirts, sweat shirts, knee pads, etc. They would have probably already have ate 3 times and had some junk food so they were going to weigh in heavy. So I'd say if a kid weighted 70lbs by the time he weighted in today he would've been at least 76-77 lbs counting the cloths. Because I know when my son weights in in his boxers. So I didn't understand this unless the kid is 10-12 lbs over then they were probably an issue with their weight to begin with.

Here's my problem with this. When the kids got there medals today(evening session) they were wearing 4lbs of cloths at least counting there singlets, shoes, shorts, shirts, sweat shirts, knee pads, etc. They would have probably already have ate 3 times and had some junk food so they were going to weigh in heavy. So I'd say if a kid weighted 70lbs by the time he weighted in today he would've been at least 76-77 lbs counting the cloths. Because I know when my son weights in in his boxers. So I didn't understand this unless the kid is 10-12 lbs over then they were probably an issue with their weight to begin with.

I agree. My son weighed in at 54.8 in his boxers on 2/08. He always wrestles Intermediate 55 when we wrestle out of state where they do weigh ins and weight classes. He weighed in under 55 at Indy Nationals two weeks ago. Yesterday he weighed 57.8 at 4:30pm with shoes, singlet, shirt and after eating two meals and snacks. We never fudge our weights, so I'd hate to be labeled a cheater when I'm not. However, if all the results being over causes us to have official weigh ins next year, I'm glad he was 3 pounds over:)

I agree. My son weighed in at 54.8 in his boxers on 2/08. He always wrestles Intermediate 55 when we wrestle out of state where they do weigh ins and weight classes. He weighed in under 55 at Indy Nationals two weeks ago. Yesterday he weighed 57.8 at 4:30pm with shoes, singlet, shirt and after eating two meals and snacks. We never fudge our weights, so I'd hate to be labeled a cheater when I'm not. However, if all the results being over causes us to have official weigh ins next year, I'm glad he was 3 pounds over:)

I agree 100%. My son weighed in at 71lbs fat on tuesday(he usually wrestles 70 out of state tourneys according to what he weighs) I think it was. Yesterday with all his clothes on and after eating all day he weighed 76. But I'm with you if this makes them have actual weight classes I'm fine with that.

I agree 100%. My son weighed in at 71lbs fat on tuesday(he usually wrestles 70 out of state tourneys according to what he weighs) I think it was. Yesterday with all his clothes on and after eating all day he weighed 76. But I'm with you if this makes them have actual weight classes I'm fine with that.

How did your team/region conduct their weigh ins? Was it done as a region with a certified referee?

Certified referee as a team this year. We usually do it as a region wirh certified referee but our regional tourney got cancelled because of snow. Blue was at middle school state the same day as our regional would've been so it worked out pretty good for him I guess.

Not sure what all the concern is with checking weights. So much fear about eating and having on sweats. As I saw it everyone was in the same boat yesterday. It was actually quite comical to see the concerns of so many dads. That tells me there is something to be looking into. Either some weight cutting or something questionable. The problem comes when your kid is 10 pounds heavier than all the other kids who also ate 2 meals and junk and had on lots of clothes. This isn't a witch hunt. Just making sure the kids are all being treated fairly.

I have no problem with the checks, so I hope I didn't imply that. I would just prefer to do actual weigh ins. I'm sure most of the kids were over by a few pounds, but I'm also sure there were some that were WAY over. My suggestion would be to do weigh ins the morning of the tourney or the night before. Then just enter the data in the bracketing program and spit the brackets out.

We don't need to have coaches moving kids around because they are "on the same team or region." This just looks bad and that person could be perceived to be trying to gain an advantage. Either do weight classes or go straight down the line with the weights and make 16 man brackets. If the computer makes the brackets, coaches and parents can't complain. It's cut and dry.

It would add that much time. There plenty of scales around because of high school state. Set up a room with 10 scales, sort the kids alphabetically, send them to the correct scale and enter the weight in the spreadsheet, send the spreadsheet to the program and print the brackets. Or better yet, do it all in Trackwrestling!

seem`s to be more people in favor of set weight classes.

i understand the argument with morning weigh ins adding time to the tournament.

so why not use regions as a true qualifier for state with only the top 2 or 3 kids from each class & region going to state.yes it`s about the kids but they need to learn how to lose also.Some have said set weights promote weight cutting we weigh our kids at every practice so we know if anything like this might be going on and to date have had no problems.Has a coach or parent if you suspect any type of unhealthy practices it is your job to report it!

Can anyone just say thank you for all of the hard work that was put into this tournament? I understand that everyone sees things that could be changed or improved but could you just start with a simple thank you first?

First;  Thank you!  Great day of wrestling.  Everyone that was involved in putting the tournament together deserve a big pat on the back.  We all had a great time.  We had 21 kids wrestle and they all had fun.  Even the ones who didn't  wrestle as well as they wished had fun.  That is what it is all about.  Most people can find some minor fault with anything that they under take much less a tournament with nearly 1000 kids.  I personally think that message boards are not the place to point out any percieved faults.  There are always room for improvements and the place to undertake these are at the meetings.  I will say that the medals were awesome.  It is sad for the KHSAA that the youth medals were twice the size and of a much better design than the high school medals.